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[Music]

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this hope radio for the masses Atlanta

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between July 8 1947

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she's on the air force Rezanov said

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applying this touches found and is now

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in the possession of the honor the game

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is rigged change the game changer

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I occasionally think how quickly our

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differences worldwide would vanish if we

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were facing an alien threat from outside

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it is working

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fade to black with your host Jimmy

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church on the game-changer Radio Network

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and kg RA the global rain

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I need your help to do a year 1985

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[Music]

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you are listening to fade to black with

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Jimmy judge on the game change in

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network

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good evening

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fade to black

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this spoke radio for Matson

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how you doing today's Wednesday 8 world

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third two thousand nineteen ninety three

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days into the new year just two hundred

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and seventy two days left we are live

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from a bunker somewhere in the middle of

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beautiful downtown Burbank California I

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would like to welcome everybody

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listening all around the world all

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across the United States hither and

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thither to and fro back and forth up and

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down east and west north and south far

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this is fade to black for kjc are the

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game changer network and kg are a the

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planet I am your host Jimmy Church what

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tonight's gonna be one of those shows

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[Music]

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Heather Lynn is here that's dr. Heather

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Lee

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she's got a new book out and it's a

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page-turner

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it's called evil archaeology demons

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possessions and sinister relics there it

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is right there great cover we've got all

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the links up to go and get the book you

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can go over to Jimmy Church radio.com go

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to dr. heather Lynn comm and there it is

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Amazon amazing book this is what this is

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what crazy dreams when you go to bed are

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made of right here this book right here

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I was just talking to her about my mind

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he start reading this and your mind just

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goes there just goes there it's a great

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book it's a great book so dr. Lin is

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here evil archeology all right that is

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the discussion tonight and tomorrow

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night is another Fator night with open

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lines all night long and that means your

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conversations your contact UFOs time

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travel evil archeology

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right I love this of lost history

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parallel worlds life after death ghosts

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the supernatural the paranormal

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everything goes down on Thursday night

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on fader night so that'll be tomorrow

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and what a great week we've had this

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week think about it Alex Mastretta on

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Monday night breaking it down last night

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Billy Carson tonight dr. heather Lynn

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man I just love this gig you can follow

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me right now on Twitter at Jay Church

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radio that's the simple thing to do and

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come over and hang out with everybody

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and enjoy the conversation and you can

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do that using the hashtag f2b that's f

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the number to be F to be which is our

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designated sandbox you named it the

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sandbox we also have to chat rooms one

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on Spreaker one over at kg RA the planet

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if you prefer the chatroom atmosphere

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we've got two of those for you

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and if you have any questions or

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comments you can post those up there for

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either me or dr. Lin at hashtag f2b q

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okay all right man what a show I cannot

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wait for this tonight you know I'm gonna

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I'm gonna get back to tonight's show

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here in just a bit but I've got to get

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to those breaking news first up tonight

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a group of experts X spies are suing the

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Defense Department and spy agencies for

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the right to publish books on their

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careers and they're trying to do it

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without being subjected to arbitrary

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censorship claiming that the

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pre-publication preview system inflicted

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on all employees with security

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clearances is overly broad and

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unconstitutional amounting to a far

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reaching system of prior restraint and

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this is according to the American Civil

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Liberties Union and the knight First

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Amendment Institute who are suing the

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Central Intelligence Agency the National

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Security Agency the Office of the

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Director of National Intelligence and

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the Defense Department on behalf of five

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former federal employees who argue that

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the confusing system has hurt them

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professionally yep and if that wasn't

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enough CIA news for you today I've

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gotten more and I anticipate

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interference with tonight's show because

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of my blabbermouth when it comes to the

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CIA or in the NSA you know I'm being

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flagged right now right that's all it

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takes that's all it takes

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I leave all the other trigger words out

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you know the ones that would really you

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know cause a breach of the bunker

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elevator and then them somehow getting

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in here yeah think about that all right

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because it was announced today that the

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CIA

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elicit tens of billions of dollars of

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work divided among multiple tech

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companies now if that didn't cause you

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to pucker right the program would also

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dramatically expand the federal market

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for technology and give a chance for

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listen to this potential contenders are

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Microsoft IBM and Oracle which are all

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trying to catch up to Amazon and selling

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cloud services to the intelligence

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community yeah

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Amazon already has a six hundred million

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dollar contract with the CIA and Oracle

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has gone to court to challenge a Defense

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Department winner-take-all solicitation

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that says it favors Amazon now about

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five years ago then and then four and

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then three Amazon announced we all knew

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that Amazon itself the book division

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right Amazon wasn't making any money and

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everybody wondered you know how how does

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that work you know you're so big you

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dominate everything but you're not

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making any money and there are the

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reports their yearly reports and all

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their filings we're saying you know what

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we're just not making any money here let

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me tell you where Amazon has invested

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where the money is and where they are

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making it Amazon owns the cloud

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computing world they own it Google

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little sliver you know if a Microsoft it

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little slivers Amazon owns it and all

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the companies out there that offer cloud

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computing services they turn around and

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sublease from Amazon that it's it's it's

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an Amazon world and when I say that I'm

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not joking

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they control it they absolutely do and

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that is where their profit comes from

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and they make ginormous dollars the

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amount of servers and cloud hard drives

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that are out there storing your

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information in the Defense Department

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and the CIA and the NSA Amazon think

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about that and that announcement was

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today and and the CIA wants to make

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these investments and they want to get

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everybody in on it think about that for

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a second

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pretty crazy all right also announced

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today

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well officials have dubbed Monday's

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bridge collapse in Tennessee a freak

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accident that's right

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but bridges across the United States are

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deteriorating and a new report released

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today estimates it will take more than

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80 years 87 to be exact to fix all of

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them that's because more than 47,000

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bridges in the United States are in

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crucial need of repairs and this is

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according to the American Road and

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transportation Builders Association

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otherwise known as art by yeah you know

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this is what this is what I find strange

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when the federal I think it was called

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the federal highways Act something close

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to it when they decided that they were

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going to build a highway system that

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would interconnect at all the main

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cities in the United States

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coast-to-coast north or south east of us

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that everything was going to be

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connected they were gonna do it in a few

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years and it was the most enormous

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construction project and infrastructure

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project ever right but we did it we did

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it you know and and how do we get to the

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point now where they're talking about 87

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years and and we can spend money and

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blow money all over the place and just

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way

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did money and we've got bridges

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collapsing in the United States you know

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about I would say it started about ten

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years ago and went on it hasn't happened

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at least publicly and probably the last

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five years but here in Los Angeles we

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had sewer lines blowing up all over the

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city it was all streets flooded this

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habited it you know it was just

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absolutely crazy and and our

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infrastructure here in LA trust me you

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know they show you pictures of of the

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beaches on postcards but what's really

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going on here in Los Angeles we have got

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to I don't care what city you pick we

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have got the worst roads and sewage

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system anywhere in the country is here

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in Los Angeles

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and they just can't you know they built

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it cheaply back then and and now we're

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paying the price I don't get it how we

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can live in this country and have these

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issues but nonetheless you know what

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you're not gonna have issues with this

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surfer music streaming app and you need

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to download it right now that's right as

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you are FR surfer su r FR dot FM go and

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download it it is completely free that's

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all you got to do there's no

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registration there's no privacy there's

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no giving up your information you're

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never gonna get an email nothing all you

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do is download it and start enjoying all

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of your favorite music and you can do it

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right now it's super easy super fun all

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you have to do is click on the banner to

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wear it to me Church radio.com alright

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su r FR dot FM surfer our next event is

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coming up it is coming up next month I

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cannot believe it it is contacting the

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desert May 31st through June 3rd in

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Indian Wells Palm Springs California

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00:14:16,050 --> 00:14:13,000
that's right at the Renaissance Indian

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Wells Resort and Spa tickets and info

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00:14:21,930 --> 00:14:19,540
are at contact in the desert com full

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weekend of events you know everything

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that's going on go and check out the

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full conference schedule and we'll see

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everybody

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00:14:29,320 --> 00:14:27,710
there you know we're gonna have a booth

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00:14:33,550 --> 00:14:29,330
we're gonna broadcast live I'm gonna

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host a panel hosting the awards dinner

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00:14:38,400 --> 00:14:36,740
on Saturday so we're gonna be hanging

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out and of course there's gonna be a

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secret party or - there's gonna be a

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Night Watch or - okay all right so go

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and get your tickets now contact in the

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00:14:53,350 --> 00:14:50,780
desert dot-com our 2019 Seoul tech

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00:14:55,810 --> 00:14:53,360
conference is coming up and it is over

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00:14:59,950 --> 00:14:55,820
the July 4th weekend at the lovely

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00:15:03,700 --> 00:14:59,960
sunrise ranch in Loveland Colorado go to

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Seoul tech gathering dot-com we've also

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00:15:09,670 --> 00:15:06,860
got a soul tech official over on

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Facebook you can go and check that out

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too as well when you go to Seoul tech

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gathering calm we have BIOS all of the

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speakers food lodging all of your

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questions are answered full conference

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schedule and all of the activities that

278
00:15:28,030 --> 00:15:25,340
we have planned over that weekend of

279
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July 4th it's going to be great and I

280
00:15:33,580 --> 00:15:31,520
still think I don't want to let this

281
00:15:38,500 --> 00:15:33,590
thought go I think we should have a

282
00:15:41,310 --> 00:15:38,510
cook-off a cook-off yeah I think we

283
00:15:46,420 --> 00:15:41,320
should have a cook-off so somebody

284
00:15:50,590 --> 00:15:46,430
Stacie somebody there in in Boulder

285
00:15:52,240 --> 00:15:50,600
Stacy has got to bring a grill so I'm

286
00:15:54,400 --> 00:15:52,250
just saying you bring the grill

287
00:15:55,780 --> 00:15:54,410
I'll bring the talent and we've got a

288
00:15:57,940 --> 00:15:55,790
lot of fader knots out there that don't

289
00:16:01,680 --> 00:15:57,950
want to show off their skills so I think

290
00:16:05,020 --> 00:16:01,690
we should have a cook-off at seoul tech

291
00:16:07,630 --> 00:16:05,030
all right don't forget to subscribe to

292
00:16:09,730 --> 00:16:07,640
our podcast it's just two dollars per

293
00:16:13,330 --> 00:16:09,740
month we have over 1,000 archive shows

294
00:16:15,700 --> 00:16:13,340
right there $2 per month click on the

295
00:16:17,620 --> 00:16:15,710
podcast banner at jimmy church radio.com

296
00:16:19,570 --> 00:16:17,630
you can also become a fade or not

297
00:16:22,960 --> 00:16:19,580
that's right over in our membership

298
00:16:25,030 --> 00:16:22,970
section on the site if those autograph

299
00:16:29,130 --> 00:16:25,040
shirts and hats and downloadable

300
00:16:31,930 --> 00:16:29,140
commercial free archives mp3s

301
00:16:34,900 --> 00:16:31,940
play it wherever you want to get a

302
00:16:37,329 --> 00:16:34,910
private email to me get all of that

303
00:16:39,520 --> 00:16:37,339
stuff become a fader not today over in

304
00:16:40,400 --> 00:16:39,530
our membership section at Jimmy Church

305
00:16:45,310 --> 00:16:40,410
radio calm

306
00:16:51,140 --> 00:16:45,320
happy birthday today to Eddie Murphy

307
00:16:53,890 --> 00:16:51,150
Eddie Murphy today is 57 coming to

308
00:16:56,660 --> 00:16:53,900
America that's all I got to say I'm not

309
00:17:00,740 --> 00:16:56,670
vampire in Brooklyn I didn't go there

310
00:17:04,370 --> 00:17:00,750
what was uh what was the cop movie with

311
00:17:05,260 --> 00:17:04,380
Nick Nolte over 48 hours what was that

312
00:17:09,370 --> 00:17:05,270
called

313
00:17:14,740 --> 00:17:09,380
it was pretty whoa

314
00:17:18,890 --> 00:17:14,750
sounded like a a World War 1 biplane

315
00:17:21,890 --> 00:17:18,900
that's my imagination yeah Eddie Murphy

316
00:17:25,040 --> 00:17:21,900
today is a chili cook-off that's not a

317
00:17:28,280 --> 00:17:25,050
bad idea but on a grill see that's gonna

318
00:17:31,250 --> 00:17:28,290
take all day but a chili cook-off okay

319
00:17:33,020 --> 00:17:31,260
we could maybe Trading Places yeah

320
00:17:35,960 --> 00:17:33,030
Trading Places is right there

321
00:17:38,870 --> 00:17:35,970
yeah I'm with you on that Eddie Murphy

322
00:17:43,070 --> 00:17:38,880
57 and there is a rumor going around in

323
00:17:46,840 --> 00:17:43,080
production is the sequel to coming to

324
00:17:49,040 --> 00:17:46,850
America yep part two yep coming back

325
00:17:53,030 --> 00:17:49,050
yeah I think that's what it's called

326
00:17:57,680 --> 00:17:53,040
coming back to America Eddie Murphy's 57

327
00:17:59,510 --> 00:17:57,690
today Alec Baldwin is 60 and that's a

328
00:18:03,080 --> 00:17:59,520
tough call with Alec because I like him

329
00:18:04,640 --> 00:18:03,090
a lot but it's really strange for me

330
00:18:08,510 --> 00:18:04,650
every time I think about him I think

331
00:18:11,060 --> 00:18:08,520
about Glengarry Glen Gary Glen Ross the

332
00:18:15,230 --> 00:18:11,070
steak knives that's right Alec Baldwin

333
00:18:18,710 --> 00:18:15,240
today is 60 and oh what I wanted to do

334
00:18:21,710 --> 00:18:18,720
and I and I just blew past it I wanted

335
00:18:26,450 --> 00:18:21,720
to light up Twitter with what will read

336
00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:26,460
abhi making stuffed chicken pasta Rita

337
00:18:32,120 --> 00:18:29,010
is not allowed in the in the in in the

338
00:18:35,750 --> 00:18:32,130
cook-off no that's that's stacking the

339
00:18:41,090 --> 00:18:35,760
deck that's stacking the deck okay what

340
00:18:42,890 --> 00:18:41,100
was I the best Beetlejuice what - Oh

341
00:18:46,490 --> 00:18:42,900
Alec Baldwin and Beetlejuice house

342
00:18:48,140 --> 00:18:46,500
thinking I was thinking Eddie Murphy the

343
00:18:51,380 --> 00:18:48,150
Alec Baldwin Beetlejuice that was pretty

344
00:18:53,900 --> 00:18:51,390
good that was pretty good your best line

345
00:18:58,640 --> 00:18:53,910
what is the best line from coming to

346
00:19:01,460 --> 00:18:58,650
America I want to see how good you guys

347
00:19:06,260 --> 00:19:01,470
are what's your best lot what is the

348
00:19:08,810 --> 00:19:06,270
best line in coming to America don't

349
00:19:13,910 --> 00:19:08,820
worry about it it's Twitter you can you

350
00:19:17,080 --> 00:19:13,920
can you can post it our dead guys

351
00:19:20,390 --> 00:19:17,090
birthday today is Marlon Brando 1924 to

352
00:19:21,950 --> 00:19:20,400
2004 died at the age of 80 one of the

353
00:19:23,390 --> 00:19:21,960
greatest actors in history there's no

354
00:19:26,210 --> 00:19:23,400
question about that because you've got

355
00:19:28,460 --> 00:19:26,220
Don Vito and the Godfather Terry Malloy

356
00:19:30,830 --> 00:19:28,470
and on the waterfront and of course

357
00:19:32,920 --> 00:19:30,840
Colonel Kurtz in Apocalypse Now and

358
00:19:37,550 --> 00:19:32,930
that's pretty much all you got to say

359
00:19:40,580 --> 00:19:37,560
happy birthday Marlon Brando he's pretty

360
00:19:43,340 --> 00:19:40,590
good in the freshmen too by the way yeah

361
00:19:49,760 --> 00:19:43,350
that boy is good that's pretty good try

362
00:19:52,600 --> 00:19:49,770
scale he's real good yeah yeah yeah yeah

363
00:19:55,930 --> 00:19:52,610
that's a good line right there all right

364
00:20:00,440 --> 00:19:55,940
where am I at on this day in history

365
00:20:02,720 --> 00:20:00,450
1996 the Unabomber is arrested at a

366
00:20:05,470 --> 00:20:02,730
small wilderness cabin near Lincoln

367
00:20:10,010 --> 00:20:05,480
Montana Theodore John Kaczynski is

368
00:20:14,740 --> 00:20:10,020
arrested by FBI agents on this day in

369
00:20:20,170 --> 00:20:14,750
1996 Fader fact okay okay

370
00:20:23,420 --> 00:20:20,180
Murph that's Rob was going Murph

371
00:20:26,270 --> 00:20:23,430
you've got my respect Murph when are we

372
00:20:28,580 --> 00:20:26,280
gonna hang out you got my respect drinks

373
00:20:32,420 --> 00:20:28,590
around me the next time I see you Murph

374
00:20:34,880 --> 00:20:32,430
because that's where I was going

375
00:20:45,530 --> 00:20:34,890
that's where I was gone all right fader

376
00:20:53,300 --> 00:20:45,540
fact 1 in 3 3 divorce filings in the

377
00:20:56,840 --> 00:20:53,310
United States include the word what okay

378
00:20:59,990 --> 00:20:56,850
so let's see a slide up Twitter right

379
00:21:04,250 --> 00:21:00,000
now let me see who can let me see who

380
00:21:06,740 --> 00:21:04,260
can guess the first person to get this

381
00:21:10,610 --> 00:21:06,750
up in

382
00:21:12,910 --> 00:21:10,620
winter fade to black coffee mug I'll do

383
00:21:17,930 --> 00:21:12,920
it right now okay you ready

384
00:21:24,170 --> 00:21:17,940
one in three divorce filings in the

385
00:21:27,410 --> 00:21:24,180
United States include the word blank one

386
00:21:35,180 --> 00:21:27,420
in three divorce filings include the

387
00:21:37,550 --> 00:21:35,190
word what that's everyone okay all right

388
00:21:39,110 --> 00:21:37,560
no nope that's a good guess there

389
00:21:43,310 --> 00:21:39,120
Madeleine that's also a pretty good idea

390
00:21:46,280 --> 00:21:43,320
I see where you go Oh Kat Nate Daniel is

391
00:21:50,030 --> 00:21:46,290
first at the same time they popped in

392
00:21:55,730 --> 00:21:50,040
together you guys are absolutely right

393
00:21:57,620 --> 00:21:55,740
Nate Daniel Facebook that's right

394
00:21:59,530 --> 00:21:57,630
Kat volkl's Facebook that came in at the

395
00:22:06,310 --> 00:21:59,540
same time you guys both got it

396
00:22:09,290 --> 00:22:06,320
inconceivable yeah buddy yeah Facebook

397
00:22:14,000 --> 00:22:09,300
one in three divorce filings today

398
00:22:16,400 --> 00:22:14,010
include the word Facebook and there's a

399
00:22:20,480 --> 00:22:16,410
reason for it by the way and I've read

400
00:22:22,670 --> 00:22:20,490
into this today Facebook is permanent

401
00:22:27,500 --> 00:22:22,680
you can delete all you want there's ways

402
00:22:33,770 --> 00:22:27,510
to go in and all divorce attorneys on

403
00:22:38,200 --> 00:22:33,780
both sides go to Facebook and dig they

404
00:22:40,970 --> 00:22:38,210
dig that's it and that's their evidence

405
00:22:43,070 --> 00:22:40,980
yeah you would think it would almost be

406
00:22:45,110 --> 00:22:43,080
the opposite of that like somebody is

407
00:22:48,200 --> 00:22:45,120
accusing and there is that too as well

408
00:22:51,260 --> 00:22:48,210
right somebody saw something on Facebook

409
00:22:53,720 --> 00:22:51,270
okay but it's in the divorce filings

410
00:22:58,790 --> 00:22:53,730
because those attorneys go and dig into

411
00:23:01,250 --> 00:22:58,800
your social networking his theory one in

412
00:23:04,610 --> 00:23:01,260
three divorce filings include the word

413
00:23:07,070 --> 00:23:04,620
Facebook tonight dr. heather Lynn she's

414
00:23:10,160 --> 00:23:07,080
back with us and we're gonna be

415
00:23:11,630 --> 00:23:10,170
discussing her new book evil archaeology

416
00:23:12,470 --> 00:23:11,640
there it is right there holding it up to

417
00:23:16,280 --> 00:23:12,480
the camera what do you think of that

418
00:23:18,140 --> 00:23:16,290
cover the cover is amazing all right so

419
00:23:19,590 --> 00:23:18,150
we're gonna discuss this demons

420
00:23:22,680 --> 00:23:19,600
possessions and

421
00:23:24,960 --> 00:23:22,690
sinister relics and we'll be doing that

422
00:23:26,520 --> 00:23:24,970
right after the break tomorrow night is

423
00:23:30,960 --> 00:23:26,530
another Fator night with open lines all

424
00:23:32,669 --> 00:23:30,970
night long and there you go now this is

425
00:23:36,200 --> 00:23:32,679
where and I'm gonna I'm gonna actually

426
00:23:41,909 --> 00:23:36,210
talk to a dr. Lynn about this tonight

427
00:23:45,180 --> 00:23:41,919
when there were two movies for me when I

428
00:23:47,100 --> 00:23:45,190
was growing up that to this day still

429
00:23:50,250 --> 00:23:47,110
scare me

430
00:23:56,190 --> 00:23:50,260
I find them completely terrifying and

431
00:23:58,440 --> 00:23:56,200
that is the Exorcist and the omen now I

432
00:24:02,029 --> 00:23:58,450
watched both of those movies at a

433
00:24:06,029 --> 00:24:02,039
terribly young age in a movie theater of

434
00:24:10,020 --> 00:24:06,039
you know rated R escorted by my parents

435
00:24:12,570 --> 00:24:10,030
and and they both scared me about the

436
00:24:16,250 --> 00:24:12,580
same but there was one thing that

437
00:24:20,789 --> 00:24:16,260
happened in both of those movies that

438
00:24:23,460 --> 00:24:20,799
set the tone for tonight and this book

439
00:24:28,440 --> 00:24:23,470
and that is both of those movies start

440
00:24:30,840 --> 00:24:28,450
off with an archaeological dig right

441
00:24:35,039 --> 00:24:30,850
somewhere in the Middle East right or

442
00:24:37,370 --> 00:24:35,049
Jerusalem or or Iraq you know it's it's

443
00:24:41,190 --> 00:24:37,380
something that's going on over there and

444
00:24:44,370 --> 00:24:41,200
they unearthed something and then all

445
00:24:50,460 --> 00:24:44,380
hell breaks loose some you know sinister

446
00:24:54,360 --> 00:24:50,470
relic and I have never let go of that in

447
00:24:58,950 --> 00:24:54,370
both of those movies today and I still

448
00:25:00,810 --> 00:24:58,960
watch him I ask Rita I mean the omen

449
00:25:02,279 --> 00:25:00,820
scares the crap out of me and I know the

450
00:25:04,919 --> 00:25:02,289
beginning the middle and the end I know

451
00:25:08,850 --> 00:25:04,929
how it I know I've read the books I've

452
00:25:10,620 --> 00:25:08,860
done all of that and I still can't help

453
00:25:14,310 --> 00:25:10,630
the feeling that I get from the

454
00:25:16,799 --> 00:25:14,320
beginning of both of those movies and in

455
00:25:21,260 --> 00:25:16,809
the omen when those knives are dug up

456
00:25:23,760 --> 00:25:21,270
you remember and they enroll the the

457
00:25:27,330 --> 00:25:23,770
pouch that they're in and those knives

458
00:25:30,289 --> 00:25:27,340
are there you just know right well

459
00:25:33,270 --> 00:25:30,299
that's what this book is about partially

460
00:25:38,310 --> 00:25:33,280
that you know that these digs have

461
00:25:41,910 --> 00:25:38,320
and throughout history one of the ways

462
00:25:48,300 --> 00:25:41,920
to hide things get rid of things punish

463
00:25:52,290 --> 00:25:48,310
things was to bury them right the bodies

464
00:25:56,580 --> 00:25:52,300
with the said relics and they unearth

465
00:25:59,760 --> 00:25:56,590
them all the time now is the Exorcist

466
00:26:01,410 --> 00:25:59,770
and the omen scary movies war flicks and

467
00:26:05,220 --> 00:26:01,420
I get all of that but they're also

468
00:26:08,760 --> 00:26:05,230
religious based is there something there

469
00:26:10,380 --> 00:26:08,770
that is based in reality well I'm here

470
00:26:13,440 --> 00:26:10,390
to tell you and especially after reading

471
00:26:15,930 --> 00:26:13,450
this book that that is what goes on

472
00:26:17,250 --> 00:26:15,940
they're out there digging and that's

473
00:26:20,040 --> 00:26:17,260
what she does

474
00:26:23,160 --> 00:26:20,050
it's gonna be a fascinating show tonight

475
00:26:27,420 --> 00:26:23,170
I cannot wait to get this discussion

476
00:26:30,660 --> 00:26:27,430
going and and as we do this conversation

477
00:26:33,630 --> 00:26:30,670
tonight I want you to do just that let

478
00:26:35,160 --> 00:26:33,640
your imagination go go back to the

479
00:26:38,130 --> 00:26:35,170
beginning of the Exorcist

480
00:26:40,230 --> 00:26:38,140
the beginning of the omen and how

481
00:26:46,110 --> 00:26:40,240
serious and what the implications were

482
00:26:46,470 --> 00:26:46,120
for the the world after that think about

483
00:26:48,030 --> 00:26:46,480
it

484
00:26:49,650 --> 00:26:48,040
this is fade to black I'm your host

485
00:26:51,500 --> 00:26:49,660
Jimmy Church it's gonna be a great

486
00:26:54,630 --> 00:26:51,510
conversation tonight tomorrow night is

487
00:26:57,950 --> 00:26:54,640
open lines all night long it is Fator

488
00:27:00,900 --> 00:26:57,960
night and as far as you guys go and gals

489
00:27:03,630 --> 00:27:00,910
you know what it is it's my favorite

490
00:27:07,050 --> 00:27:03,640
night of the week where I can just sit

491
00:27:09,060 --> 00:27:07,060
down relax and talk with all of you so

492
00:27:10,620 --> 00:27:09,070
we'll be doing that tomorrow night this

493
00:27:13,050 --> 00:27:10,630
is fade to black I'm your host Jimmy

494
00:27:16,560 --> 00:27:13,060
Church you can follow me on twitter @jj

495
00:27:18,420 --> 00:27:16,570
Church radio dr. Heather Lin used to be

496
00:27:22,670 --> 00:27:18,430
on Twitter normally right now I would

497
00:27:27,300 --> 00:27:22,680
give our guests a Twitter account teeth

498
00:27:30,510 --> 00:27:27,310
up and ask her why she's no longer on

499
00:27:33,750 --> 00:27:30,520
Twitter and so there you go but it is

500
00:27:35,280 --> 00:27:33,760
doctor heather Lynn dot-com fade to

501
00:27:36,660 --> 00:27:35,290
black I'm the game changer network in

502
00:27:38,850 --> 00:27:36,670
kgr a the planet

503
00:27:39,990 --> 00:27:38,860
I'll be back with our guest right after

504
00:27:59,520 --> 00:27:40,000
this short break stay with us

505
00:27:59,530 --> 00:28:06,040
[Music]

506
00:28:10,570 --> 00:28:08,500
this is Nicole Church daughter of

507
00:28:12,550 --> 00:28:10,580
you-know-who and you're listening to

508
00:28:17,770 --> 00:28:12,560
fade to black on Jimmy Church radio.com

509
00:28:23,010 --> 00:28:17,780
and the GameChanger network you're

510
00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:26,550
[Music]

511
00:28:40,180 --> 00:28:37,780
are a radio when you take the beams from

512
00:28:42,640 --> 00:28:40,190
Central America with dashes of

513
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Indonesian and African mixed in and then

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roast it to the dark side of fade to

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black you create the ultimate brew of

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Fringe introducing the fade to black

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moons darkest customized roast was

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smoking the beans is in every sip of

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like the bunker leaning further into the

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darkness of the roast is fade to black

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blend from river moon coffee just click

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on the banner at Jimmy Church radio.com

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and use the promo code F to B blend for

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this is Jimmy Church of fade to black

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and you can get our podcast for just $2

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per month all you have to do is click on

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the podcast banner over at Jimmy Church

535
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radio.com

536
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hey folks guess what the number one

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email you ready we love this tea we love

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we love this tea life change tea gives

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slogan perfectly the tea that makes you

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did go too fast start diet calm hi this

589
00:32:30,910 --> 00:32:07,140
is Rob Reiner from anvil and you're

590
00:32:34,830 --> 00:32:32,570
[Music]

591
00:32:37,049 --> 00:32:34,840
welcome back betta block I'm your host

592
00:32:39,960 --> 00:32:37,059
Jimmy church tonight dr. heather Lynn is

593
00:32:43,460 --> 00:32:39,970
here tomorrow night is open lines Bay

594
00:32:48,180 --> 00:32:43,470
tonight open lines all night long

595
00:32:53,340 --> 00:32:48,190
this weekend I'm off it it's it's it's

596
00:32:56,070 --> 00:32:53,350
yard work yeah that's my future maybe a

597
00:32:57,720 --> 00:32:56,080
little cookout too as well tonight it's

598
00:33:00,540 --> 00:32:57,730
dr. heather Lynn she's an author

599
00:33:02,160 --> 00:33:00,550
historian renegade archaeologist she's

600
00:33:04,830 --> 00:33:02,170
on a quest to uncover the truth behind

601
00:33:06,630 --> 00:33:04,840
ancient mysteries shields numerous

602
00:33:08,370 --> 00:33:06,640
degrees and certificates in both history

603
00:33:10,500 --> 00:33:08,380
and archaeology and as a member of the

604
00:33:12,870 --> 00:33:10,510
professional organizations including the

605
00:33:15,270 --> 00:33:12,880
American Historical Association the

606
00:33:17,760 --> 00:33:15,280
Society for historical archaeology the

607
00:33:19,760 --> 00:33:17,770
SHA the association of ancient

608
00:33:22,950 --> 00:33:19,770
historians and the world archaeological

609
00:33:24,690 --> 00:33:22,960
Congress in addition to appearances on

610
00:33:26,760 --> 00:33:24,700
radio programs like coast to coast am

611
00:33:28,950 --> 00:33:26,770
and right here on fade to black she's

612
00:33:31,650 --> 00:33:28,960
also a historical consultant for the

613
00:33:34,200 --> 00:33:31,660
television programs including ancient

614
00:33:35,790 --> 00:33:34,210
aliens tonight we are going to talk

615
00:33:38,370 --> 00:33:35,800
about the new book I'm holding it up for

616
00:33:40,919 --> 00:33:38,380
the cameras right here evil archaeology

617
00:33:42,870 --> 00:33:40,929
and we are going to dive deep into

618
00:33:44,910 --> 00:33:42,880
demons and possession and sinister

619
00:33:47,220 --> 00:33:44,920
artifacts and other gruesome

620
00:33:49,410 --> 00:33:47,230
archaeological discoveries I would like

621
00:33:52,620 --> 00:33:49,420
to welcome back to fade to black dr.

622
00:33:54,900 --> 00:33:52,630
heather Lynn dr. Heather I you know we

623
00:33:55,320 --> 00:33:54,910
we had this discussion before what do I

624
00:34:05,190 --> 00:33:55,330
do

625
00:34:07,020 --> 00:34:05,200
Heather's I put that I make sure I put

626
00:34:09,359 --> 00:34:07,030
the doctor in front of the Heather Lynn

627
00:34:10,950 --> 00:34:09,369
for advertising because if you google

628
00:34:12,869 --> 00:34:10,960
heather Lynn you'll find a lot of

629
00:34:15,389 --> 00:34:12,879
different Heather lens and a lot of them

630
00:34:21,960 --> 00:34:15,399
are in different professions shall we

631
00:34:24,530 --> 00:34:21,970
say that might be a different yeah right

632
00:34:28,889 --> 00:34:24,540
well look you earned it first off I mean

633
00:34:31,290 --> 00:34:28,899
that that I don't have any of those

634
00:34:33,090 --> 00:34:31,300
three-letter professional things you

635
00:34:35,609 --> 00:34:33,100
know following my name I'd be touting

636
00:34:36,960 --> 00:34:35,619
that everywhere I go doesn't matter you

637
00:34:39,530 --> 00:34:36,970
know would you like fries with this

638
00:34:43,029 --> 00:34:39,540
shake yes but call me doctor right now

639
00:34:45,279 --> 00:34:43,039
it's just the way it would play out

640
00:34:47,529 --> 00:34:45,289
it's been a while since you've been on

641
00:34:48,999 --> 00:34:47,539
with this obviously we've got the new

642
00:34:49,329 --> 00:34:49,009
book here but what else have you been up

643
00:34:53,289 --> 00:34:49,339
to

644
00:34:55,389 --> 00:34:53,299
Oh a lot of writing I have a couple

645
00:34:57,309 --> 00:34:55,399
books in the pipeline coming out so I'm

646
00:34:59,799 --> 00:34:57,319
one after another so I've been doing a

647
00:35:02,819 --> 00:34:59,809
lot of writing a lot of researches you

648
00:35:05,349 --> 00:35:02,829
would imagine working with the

649
00:35:07,900 --> 00:35:05,359
production company I have a project in

650
00:35:09,459 --> 00:35:07,910
the works that um you know I can't get

651
00:35:11,440 --> 00:35:09,469
into all the details about but it's a

652
00:35:13,779 --> 00:35:11,450
for cable television so that should be

653
00:35:16,299 --> 00:35:13,789
pretty exciting so doing a lot of things

654
00:35:17,579 --> 00:35:16,309
that way so yeah some top secret things

655
00:35:21,579 --> 00:35:17,589
and whatnot but yeah I've been real busy

656
00:35:23,950 --> 00:35:21,589
good times we've been traveling a little

657
00:35:26,019 --> 00:35:23,960
bit but not as much as I would like I've

658
00:35:27,940 --> 00:35:26,029
been kind of stuck in my office doing a

659
00:35:28,989 --> 00:35:27,950
lot of the now I shouldn't put it that

660
00:35:30,759 --> 00:35:28,999
way I'm very grateful to have the

661
00:35:33,430 --> 00:35:30,769
opportunity to actually be stuck in my

662
00:35:34,870 --> 00:35:33,440
office to do this sort of work but you

663
00:35:38,019 --> 00:35:34,880
know I know that I've wrapped up some of

664
00:35:41,739 --> 00:35:38,029
these writing projects I'm I'm having a

665
00:35:43,900 --> 00:35:41,749
whole lot of play I plan on doing a lot

666
00:35:45,969 --> 00:35:43,910
more traveling like I said I'm working

667
00:35:47,920 --> 00:35:45,979
on a television program that will have

668
00:35:49,329 --> 00:35:47,930
me pretty much going everywhere so I

669
00:35:51,390 --> 00:35:49,339
look forward to traveling a lot more

670
00:35:55,539 --> 00:35:51,400
this year well as a renegade

671
00:35:57,549 --> 00:35:55,549
archaeologists have you have you noticed

672
00:35:59,890 --> 00:35:57,559
and are excited about especially it

673
00:36:02,769 --> 00:35:59,900
seems like the last two years where

674
00:36:04,690 --> 00:36:02,779
there is a lot being dug up around the

675
00:36:07,779 --> 00:36:04,700
world it doesn't matter if it's you know

676
00:36:10,509 --> 00:36:07,789
Germany or Russia or the Middle East and

677
00:36:13,839 --> 00:36:10,519
and Egypt and even here in the United

678
00:36:17,859 --> 00:36:13,849
States of some very exciting stuff has

679
00:36:19,779 --> 00:36:17,869
been happening in North in South America

680
00:36:22,180 --> 00:36:19,789
woody what do you make of that that it's

681
00:36:24,849 --> 00:36:22,190
getting into the mainstream media like

682
00:36:25,509 --> 00:36:24,859
it is I've never noticed it like this

683
00:36:30,609 --> 00:36:25,519
before

684
00:36:33,099 --> 00:36:30,619
it is pretty amazing it it's I'm I'm not

685
00:36:35,019 --> 00:36:33,109
surprised actually I know that there has

686
00:36:38,200 --> 00:36:35,029
been a push to be more transparent

687
00:36:40,150 --> 00:36:38,210
thankfully so Pete and it also helps

688
00:36:41,769 --> 00:36:40,160
with funding so a lot of people have

689
00:36:43,450 --> 00:36:41,779
realized that when they open their

690
00:36:45,459 --> 00:36:43,460
research up to the public and get people

691
00:36:47,920 --> 00:36:45,469
excited over it people are more likely

692
00:36:49,779 --> 00:36:47,930
to support the work and then the funding

693
00:36:52,450 --> 00:36:49,789
sort of comes in as a result or at least

694
00:36:56,030 --> 00:36:52,460
they hope that that's the case so but

695
00:36:58,970 --> 00:36:56,040
yeah I think you're seeing to a bigger

696
00:37:01,280 --> 00:36:58,980
effort to combat what is called pseudo

697
00:37:03,260 --> 00:37:01,290
archeology I've seen a lot of these

698
00:37:05,570 --> 00:37:03,270
articles come across my desk from

699
00:37:08,630 --> 00:37:05,580
mainstream archeologists who sort of

700
00:37:10,970 --> 00:37:08,640
recognize that there is a problem in the

701
00:37:13,760 --> 00:37:10,980
way they communicate or do not

702
00:37:16,930 --> 00:37:13,770
communicate with the general public so

703
00:37:19,310 --> 00:37:16,940
this for a long time you have

704
00:37:21,560 --> 00:37:19,320
archaeologists and scholars in general

705
00:37:24,230 --> 00:37:21,570
who are basically writing for each other

706
00:37:25,700 --> 00:37:24,240
they write in what's called academia so

707
00:37:29,090 --> 00:37:25,710
that it's just sort of understood

708
00:37:31,520 --> 00:37:29,100
between the academics and it's in hidden

709
00:37:33,680 --> 00:37:31,530
in databases that only academics can

710
00:37:36,980 --> 00:37:33,690
access and it's just sort of a closed

711
00:37:39,110 --> 00:37:36,990
system well it you know and that's I

712
00:37:41,090 --> 00:37:39,120
think what's happening now is they're

713
00:37:44,930 --> 00:37:41,100
realizing that because they've been so

714
00:37:46,640 --> 00:37:44,940
closer it leaves a vacuum and people

715
00:37:48,530 --> 00:37:46,650
want to know about our past and they

716
00:37:49,940 --> 00:37:48,540
want to know about all of the work

717
00:37:51,560 --> 00:37:49,950
that's going on and so if there's a

718
00:37:55,460 --> 00:37:51,570
vacuum then other people will fill it

719
00:37:57,710 --> 00:37:55,470
and that can be with any any kind of

720
00:37:59,210 --> 00:37:57,720
Theory whether it's the most fringe to

721
00:38:01,310 --> 00:37:59,220
just you know anything that goes

722
00:38:03,260 --> 00:38:01,320
anywhere near against the mainstream

723
00:38:05,540 --> 00:38:03,270
narrative well that's made them quite

724
00:38:07,450 --> 00:38:05,550
uncomfortable and so they have actually

725
00:38:09,500 --> 00:38:07,460
had meetings there's been lots of

726
00:38:13,850 --> 00:38:09,510
roundtable discussions and workshops

727
00:38:15,890 --> 00:38:13,860
about how do they combat the rise of

728
00:38:17,660 --> 00:38:15,900
what they call pseudo archeology and so

729
00:38:19,970 --> 00:38:17,670
what you have now are a lot of people

730
00:38:22,400 --> 00:38:19,980
doing public outreach archaeologists

731
00:38:24,470 --> 00:38:22,410
trying their best to you know reach out

732
00:38:26,480 --> 00:38:24,480
to the public but with sort of funny is

733
00:38:29,180 --> 00:38:26,490
they're they're doing it quite clumsily

734
00:38:31,520 --> 00:38:29,190
so you'll have you know some

735
00:38:33,470 --> 00:38:31,530
archaeologists - well I'll give a

736
00:38:35,930 --> 00:38:33,480
personal example for one my book is

737
00:38:38,300 --> 00:38:35,940
called evil archaeology before it came

738
00:38:40,310 --> 00:38:38,310
out it was already attacked which is

739
00:38:42,410 --> 00:38:40,320
absolutely silly and unfair because it's

740
00:38:44,570 --> 00:38:42,420
it's really not I wouldn't call it too

741
00:38:47,060 --> 00:38:44,580
controversial but it got attacked on

742
00:38:49,100 --> 00:38:47,070
Amazon and people started raiding it

743
00:38:51,110 --> 00:38:49,110
before it was even out before you could

744
00:38:53,930 --> 00:38:51,120
even review it so they put terrible

745
00:38:55,880 --> 00:38:53,940
reviews on and said you know oh I guess

746
00:38:57,710 --> 00:38:55,890
you know another one of these fringe

747
00:38:59,540 --> 00:38:57,720
books or something to that effect and I

748
00:39:00,800 --> 00:38:59,550
researched who it was that you know put

749
00:39:03,380 --> 00:39:00,810
that out there and I found that it was

750
00:39:05,270 --> 00:39:03,390
somebody linked to a very popular

751
00:39:08,060 --> 00:39:05,280
podcast and and media outlet of

752
00:39:08,960 --> 00:39:08,070
mainstream academic archaeologists who

753
00:39:11,000 --> 00:39:08,970
go

754
00:39:12,920 --> 00:39:11,010
about and sort of act like they're the

755
00:39:14,630 --> 00:39:12,930
champions of the mainstream and they're

756
00:39:17,210 --> 00:39:14,640
going to get these fringe people and

757
00:39:19,400 --> 00:39:17,220
whatnot so I found that what they did

758
00:39:22,099 --> 00:39:19,410
too is they they came out with their own

759
00:39:24,140 --> 00:39:22,109
publication called spooky archaeology I

760
00:39:25,940 --> 00:39:24,150
hate to give them a plug but it doesn't

761
00:39:28,190 --> 00:39:25,950
really matter too much because it's a

762
00:39:31,099 --> 00:39:28,200
it's a misnomer and they came out with

763
00:39:34,070 --> 00:39:31,109
this book right before mine that looks

764
00:39:36,410 --> 00:39:34,080
to be similar to mine but it's

765
00:39:39,140 --> 00:39:36,420
absolutely not when you've really look

766
00:39:41,480 --> 00:39:39,150
into it it's a whole diatribe against

767
00:39:43,160 --> 00:39:41,490
pseudo archeology it's completely

768
00:39:46,130 --> 00:39:43,170
nothing like what it's supposed to be

769
00:39:47,480 --> 00:39:46,140
and it's about seventy dollars last I

770
00:39:50,330 --> 00:39:47,490
checked and it was because it was

771
00:39:51,980 --> 00:39:50,340
printed on a university press and so my

772
00:39:53,690 --> 00:39:51,990
thought is well good job guys if you're

773
00:39:55,970 --> 00:39:53,700
really trying to be transparent and

774
00:39:59,320 --> 00:39:55,980
reach out and and you know then maybe

775
00:40:01,609 --> 00:39:59,330
try writing a more interesting book and

776
00:40:04,099 --> 00:40:01,619
price it a little better than 70

777
00:40:06,320 --> 00:40:04,109
textbook price like it was absolutely

778
00:40:09,349 --> 00:40:06,330
ridiculous but the whole thing isn't

779
00:40:12,349 --> 00:40:09,359
even about spooky archeology it's about

780
00:40:14,120 --> 00:40:12,359
them going on rants about how bad fringe

781
00:40:15,589 --> 00:40:14,130
and alternative ideas are so it's sort

782
00:40:18,560 --> 00:40:15,599
of a bait and switch sort of thing but

783
00:40:20,329 --> 00:40:18,570
yeah it's it's it's it's a shame so but

784
00:40:21,980 --> 00:40:20,339
there is a lot of rumblings in the

785
00:40:24,349 --> 00:40:21,990
mainstream right now I think that the

786
00:40:25,820 --> 00:40:24,359
alternative is really really gotten them

787
00:40:29,540 --> 00:40:25,830
down I don't know if you heard the

788
00:40:32,900 --> 00:40:29,550
latest but Stonehenge has a partnership

789
00:40:34,849 --> 00:40:32,910
now with ancient aliens who were so

790
00:40:37,760 --> 00:40:34,859
generous as to give them funding which

791
00:40:39,740 --> 00:40:37,770
they needed and bringing attention to

792
00:40:41,780 --> 00:40:39,750
some of their needs and you'd think this

793
00:40:44,000 --> 00:40:41,790
was a good thing but the mainstream

794
00:40:45,859 --> 00:40:44,010
archeologists are losing their minds

795
00:40:47,900 --> 00:40:45,869
they're losing their minds saying this

796
00:40:49,760 --> 00:40:47,910
is an outrage how could they do this how

797
00:40:52,099 --> 00:40:49,770
could they partner and you know with

798
00:40:54,320 --> 00:40:52,109
with this such a terrible show and and

799
00:40:55,730 --> 00:40:54,330
you know regardless of what you'd think

800
00:40:59,290 --> 00:40:55,740
about the show or its theories or

801
00:41:03,530 --> 00:40:59,300
whatever it just seems sort of you know

802
00:41:06,800 --> 00:41:03,540
petty to go attacking and something that

803
00:41:10,300 --> 00:41:06,810
a lot of people like and enjoy and you

804
00:41:12,800 --> 00:41:10,310
know it's it's benefiting Stonehenge

805
00:41:16,280 --> 00:41:12,810
culture where were all of those

806
00:41:18,290 --> 00:41:16,290
professional organizations three four

807
00:41:19,990 --> 00:41:18,300
five years ago when the Planning

808
00:41:23,620 --> 00:41:20,000
Commission started to plan

809
00:41:26,680 --> 00:41:23,630
and a tunnel underneath a stonehenge or

810
00:41:28,150 --> 00:41:26,690
new road or you know wait a minute if

811
00:41:31,390 --> 00:41:28,160
you want to preserve if you want to have

812
00:41:33,520 --> 00:41:31,400
integrity stop that you know and

813
00:41:36,240 --> 00:41:33,530
obviously I was out where how I just

814
00:41:38,980 --> 00:41:36,250
thought to myself how can schools and

815
00:41:40,840 --> 00:41:38,990
and these though you know where all of

816
00:41:43,900 --> 00:41:40,850
this archaeological funding comes from

817
00:41:46,810 --> 00:41:43,910
and then that trickles down from you

818
00:41:49,270 --> 00:41:46,820
know states and governments where are

819
00:41:50,770 --> 00:41:49,280
you when something like this is going on

820
00:41:52,660 --> 00:41:50,780
with one of the most historical places

821
00:41:53,260 --> 00:41:52,670
on the planet there's no question about

822
00:41:56,290 --> 00:41:53,270
that

823
00:42:01,720 --> 00:41:56,300
you can't deface or dig or do anything

824
00:42:03,940 --> 00:42:01,730
to that in fact move the road you don't

825
00:42:05,500 --> 00:42:03,950
need a tunnel underneath stone it builds

826
00:42:07,390 --> 00:42:05,510
up people what what are you talking

827
00:42:10,630 --> 00:42:07,400
about but nobody wanted to say anything

828
00:42:12,700 --> 00:42:10,640
so ancient aliens comes in and offers a

829
00:42:14,950 --> 00:42:12,710
little bit of help and now and this is

830
00:42:18,130 --> 00:42:14,960
the other thing Heather and I'm not I'm

831
00:42:22,270 --> 00:42:18,140
not exaggerating in the least here

832
00:42:26,410 --> 00:42:22,280
ancient aliens like it or not has done

833
00:42:30,070 --> 00:42:26,420
more for tourism in Egypt and Peru and

834
00:42:35,260 --> 00:42:30,080
Bolivia and Mexico and Stonehenge than

835
00:42:38,170 --> 00:42:35,270
anybody else that's you just can't do

836
00:42:41,710 --> 00:42:38,180
that people want answers which goes back

837
00:42:44,110 --> 00:42:41,720
i'm i don't want to ramble but i want to

838
00:42:47,320 --> 00:42:44,120
go back to to your point when we talk

839
00:42:52,780 --> 00:42:47,330
about pseudo archaeology that that is

840
00:42:56,410 --> 00:42:52,790
coming from or or orthodox academia it

841
00:42:59,500 --> 00:42:56,420
they the reason for them is saying that

842
00:43:02,860 --> 00:42:59,510
is because of the vacuum you referred to

843
00:43:05,760 --> 00:43:02,870
if they would be more transparent then

844
00:43:08,110 --> 00:43:05,770
people wouldn't go and write this story

845
00:43:11,770 --> 00:43:08,120
people wouldn't go and fill in the

846
00:43:13,720 --> 00:43:11,780
blanks because of them there's big big

847
00:43:15,670 --> 00:43:13,730
issues out there right now that they

848
00:43:18,220 --> 00:43:15,680
want to continue to keep their heads

849
00:43:21,310 --> 00:43:18,230
buried in the sand about and one of them

850
00:43:21,850 --> 00:43:21,320
is the history of us right and that's a

851
00:43:24,280 --> 00:43:21,860
big one

852
00:43:26,320 --> 00:43:24,290
it's the history of us and we want these

853
00:43:29,380 --> 00:43:26,330
answers are they buried out there

854
00:43:31,540 --> 00:43:29,390
somewhere in some warehouse do you know

855
00:43:32,320 --> 00:43:31,550
something that we don't are you holding

856
00:43:35,880 --> 00:43:32,330
back

857
00:43:37,890 --> 00:43:35,890
the silence is deafening and that's when

858
00:43:39,760 --> 00:43:37,900
they want to call them SUNY

859
00:43:42,040 --> 00:43:39,770
archeologists but people that are

860
00:43:44,920 --> 00:43:42,050
interested in the research like yourself

861
00:43:45,340 --> 00:43:44,930
too as well absolutely that's absolutely

862
00:43:48,010 --> 00:43:45,350
correct

863
00:43:50,670 --> 00:43:48,020
and another another point that that

864
00:43:53,560 --> 00:43:50,680
sticks out to me most recently was a

865
00:43:56,680 --> 00:43:53,570
discussion that was going on on a close

866
00:43:59,980 --> 00:43:56,690
sort of board of historians and it was

867
00:44:02,890 --> 00:43:59,990
spurred by an article from The Chronicle

868
00:44:06,490 --> 00:44:02,900
of Higher Education magazine it was

869
00:44:08,620 --> 00:44:06,500
entitled historians we are we are not

870
00:44:10,870 --> 00:44:08,630
your servants and I thought what is this

871
00:44:12,400 --> 00:44:10,880
and so you know I read the story I look

872
00:44:14,080 --> 00:44:12,410
at the dialogue that's going along and I

873
00:44:14,530 --> 00:44:14,090
I was appalled I couldn't even believe

874
00:44:18,540 --> 00:44:14,540
it

875
00:44:20,620 --> 00:44:18,550
these people were complaining that they

876
00:44:23,410 --> 00:44:20,630
shouldn't have to answer the public's

877
00:44:25,030 --> 00:44:23,420
questions because this is their service

878
00:44:27,250 --> 00:44:25,040
this is how they make a living they

879
00:44:29,020 --> 00:44:27,260
likened it to giving free legal advice

880
00:44:30,400 --> 00:44:29,030
or health advice and that that was

881
00:44:31,990 --> 00:44:30,410
unprofessional and inappropriate and

882
00:44:34,030 --> 00:44:32,000
they shouldn't have to do that and I

883
00:44:36,910 --> 00:44:34,040
thought is this really where we've come

884
00:44:39,150 --> 00:44:36,920
and no wonder there's a vacuum I looked

885
00:44:42,790 --> 00:44:39,160
at it like this I became a historian

886
00:44:44,980 --> 00:44:42,800
because I was excited about learning

887
00:44:47,380 --> 00:44:44,990
history I was excited about the things

888
00:44:48,430 --> 00:44:47,390
that I found out I wanted to share that

889
00:44:51,130 --> 00:44:48,440
information

890
00:44:52,900 --> 00:44:51,140
I wanted to correct the record or or

891
00:44:55,960 --> 00:44:52,910
just share I just simply wanted to teach

892
00:44:58,540 --> 00:44:55,970
and share and for somebody to say yeah

893
00:45:00,490 --> 00:44:58,550
but no my time is valuable and I'm not

894
00:45:03,310 --> 00:45:00,500
going to answer your questions what good

895
00:45:05,230 --> 00:45:03,320
are you a historian tells stories you're

896
00:45:07,840 --> 00:45:05,240
supposed to tell a story you're supposed

897
00:45:11,860 --> 00:45:07,850
to speak and and so right now in the

898
00:45:14,590 --> 00:45:11,870
industry they are objecting to this

899
00:45:16,840 --> 00:45:14,600
notion that anyone dare ask a question

900
00:45:19,990 --> 00:45:16,850
to them in fact they've they've come out

901
00:45:22,420 --> 00:45:20,000
with this advice to each other that if a

902
00:45:24,910 --> 00:45:22,430
student and not just any but a student

903
00:45:27,520 --> 00:45:24,920
if they email you with a question you

904
00:45:29,980 --> 00:45:27,530
need to vet them very well and then

905
00:45:33,160 --> 00:45:29,990
still yeah maybe or maybe not answer

906
00:45:36,930 --> 00:45:33,170
their question and I thought what this

907
00:45:40,480 --> 00:45:36,940
just does it boggles my mind completely

908
00:45:42,190 --> 00:45:40,490
the absolute opposite so now what so now

909
00:45:44,590 --> 00:45:42,200
if somebody is watching ancient aliens

910
00:45:46,120 --> 00:45:44,600
and there might be something inaccurate

911
00:45:47,589 --> 00:45:46,130
or or that they may disagree with

912
00:45:49,630 --> 00:45:47,599
you know whatever if they have a

913
00:45:52,059 --> 00:45:49,640
question they think well maybe I'd like

914
00:45:55,329 --> 00:45:52,069
to contact that historian up at my local

915
00:45:57,519 --> 00:45:55,339
university but they'll not respond to

916
00:46:00,789 --> 00:45:57,529
them and so and then they go around and

917
00:46:04,049 --> 00:46:00,799
complain that well you know they don't

918
00:46:07,989 --> 00:46:04,059
listen to us nobody listens to nobodies

919
00:46:09,940 --> 00:46:07,999
maniculatus to themselves in there I

920
00:46:12,609 --> 00:46:09,950
think they're going down as a result I

921
00:46:14,650 --> 00:46:12,619
see the rise and alternative thinking an

922
00:46:16,900 --> 00:46:14,660
alternative archaeology and it's like

923
00:46:18,519 --> 00:46:16,910
well you know this is what happens and I

924
00:46:20,259 --> 00:46:18,529
think it's fine I think there's nothing

925
00:46:22,900 --> 00:46:20,269
wrong with it I think we need to be able

926
00:46:25,749 --> 00:46:22,910
to be comfortable and secure our own

927
00:46:28,690 --> 00:46:25,759
thoughts and be able to explore ideas

928
00:46:30,279 --> 00:46:28,700
that sort of go against what we may

929
00:46:32,289 --> 00:46:30,289
believe or go against what we think

930
00:46:34,569 --> 00:46:32,299
that's that's important it's to push us

931
00:46:36,789 --> 00:46:34,579
out of those boxes that sometimes we put

932
00:46:38,739 --> 00:46:36,799
ourselves in even but yeah the idea that

933
00:46:41,200 --> 00:46:38,749
somebody were to ask me a question and

934
00:46:41,650 --> 00:46:41,210
I'd say well I'm not on the clock sorry

935
00:46:46,239 --> 00:46:41,660
about that

936
00:46:47,769 --> 00:46:46,249
it's just preposterous to me so no I but

937
00:46:49,420 --> 00:46:47,779
that's that's an example of some of the

938
00:46:52,450 --> 00:46:49,430
problems that are going on right now and

939
00:46:55,150 --> 00:46:52,460
in the field yeah I I've gotten into a

940
00:46:57,339 --> 00:46:55,160
couple of heated discussions over the

941
00:47:00,759 --> 00:46:57,349
years with different archaeologists and

942
00:47:04,410 --> 00:47:00,769
anthropologists about homo sapien sapien

943
00:47:09,969 --> 00:47:04,420
and and the missing link and Darwin and

944
00:47:12,279 --> 00:47:09,979
they are so steadfast in that ok we

945
00:47:16,359 --> 00:47:12,289
don't have all the answers but we know

946
00:47:18,789 --> 00:47:16,369
that we evolved from blah blah blah blah

947
00:47:20,650 --> 00:47:18,799
blah that there wasn't anything magical

948
00:47:23,940 --> 00:47:20,660
there wasn't anything strange there

949
00:47:28,479 --> 00:47:23,950
wasn't anything you know wait a minute

950
00:47:32,559 --> 00:47:28,489
we just appeared right 150 thousand

951
00:47:34,420 --> 00:47:32,569
years ago with our glorious selves with

952
00:47:37,120 --> 00:47:34,430
our bodies and our faces and everything

953
00:47:40,299 --> 00:47:37,130
nothing like cro-magnon or Neanderthal

954
00:47:42,969 --> 00:47:40,309
or Homo erectus or any going back to

955
00:47:45,039 --> 00:47:42,979
Lucy which we're all primates I don't

956
00:47:48,120 --> 00:47:45,049
care what anybody says you know that

957
00:47:52,709 --> 00:47:48,130
forehead that jaw that build those bones

958
00:47:58,100 --> 00:47:52,719
that's what we're talking about here us

959
00:48:01,970 --> 00:47:58,110
humans today are unique not only unique

960
00:48:05,420 --> 00:48:01,980
on this planet just unique to everything

961
00:48:06,440 --> 00:48:05,430
so how did we get here well Jimmy you

962
00:48:11,620 --> 00:48:06,450
don't understand

963
00:48:14,330 --> 00:48:11,630
anthropology you see no I do actually

964
00:48:16,460 --> 00:48:14,340
what I'm trying to say is we just

965
00:48:18,800 --> 00:48:16,470
appeared so where's the missing link if

966
00:48:21,050 --> 00:48:18,810
Darwin is right and this is the the

967
00:48:23,120 --> 00:48:21,060
problem that I have if Darwin is right

968
00:48:26,870 --> 00:48:23,130
then we've got millions of years of

969
00:48:29,300 --> 00:48:26,880
evolution behind us where is it it

970
00:48:31,400 --> 00:48:29,310
doesn't exist right this the the

971
00:48:33,680 --> 00:48:31,410
proverbial missing link but they don't

972
00:48:34,760 --> 00:48:33,690
want to talk about that do you know they

973
00:48:36,200 --> 00:48:34,770
just want to say you know what you're

974
00:48:37,370 --> 00:48:36,210
not smart enough you're not an

975
00:48:40,130 --> 00:48:37,380
archaeologist you're not an

976
00:48:40,730 --> 00:48:40,140
anthropologist you know we know you

977
00:48:44,120 --> 00:48:40,740
don't

978
00:48:46,430 --> 00:48:44,130
it sounds fantastical okay but but we

979
00:48:48,770 --> 00:48:46,440
know that we evolved here and I just

980
00:48:51,980 --> 00:48:48,780
want an explanation Heather that's all

981
00:48:55,370 --> 00:48:51,990
and they won't give ya and it's a very

982
00:48:59,030 --> 00:48:55,380
elitist discipline for sure and that's

983
00:49:01,460 --> 00:48:59,040
that's sort of the opposite of my my

984
00:49:03,830 --> 00:49:01,470
beliefs at I I'm not elitist in any way

985
00:49:05,900 --> 00:49:03,840
I I couldn't afford to be elitist

986
00:49:08,030 --> 00:49:05,910
my background is is certainly the

987
00:49:10,250 --> 00:49:08,040
opposite of all that so when I went to

988
00:49:12,590 --> 00:49:10,260
college I went for well first off I

989
00:49:14,930 --> 00:49:12,600
didn't even finish high school I ran

990
00:49:17,810 --> 00:49:14,940
away from home at 16 years old and

991
00:49:20,210 --> 00:49:17,820
started traveling the country and and

992
00:49:24,620 --> 00:49:20,220
just had all sorts of wacky adventures I

993
00:49:26,420 --> 00:49:24,630
guess we'll call him that I I took a

994
00:49:28,640 --> 00:49:26,430
very non-traditional route to these

995
00:49:30,020 --> 00:49:28,650
sorts of things but I think that was

996
00:49:32,030 --> 00:49:30,030
actually one of the things that got me

997
00:49:34,580 --> 00:49:32,040
into this to begin with is travelling

998
00:49:37,220 --> 00:49:34,590
across the country like that late-night

999
00:49:39,530 --> 00:49:37,230
radio and that was a big part of the

1000
00:49:42,500 --> 00:49:39,540
experience and you're meeting people and

1001
00:49:44,450 --> 00:49:42,510
truck stops and diners and talking to

1002
00:49:46,340 --> 00:49:44,460
them all hours of the night about what

1003
00:49:48,950 --> 00:49:46,350
they saw on the road and their personal

1004
00:49:51,020 --> 00:49:48,960
experiences and that sort of thing just

1005
00:49:53,750 --> 00:49:51,030
stuck with me for a very long time and

1006
00:49:55,550 --> 00:49:53,760
when I went back to school I started at

1007
00:49:59,000 --> 00:49:55,560
Community College and I just worked my

1008
00:50:00,320 --> 00:49:59,010
way up from there and so I struggled

1009
00:50:01,820 --> 00:50:00,330
through the whole thing I mean you know

1010
00:50:04,100 --> 00:50:01,830
it's cost a lot of money and it's a lot

1011
00:50:07,040 --> 00:50:04,110
of work and and not to mention the the

1012
00:50:09,110 --> 00:50:07,050
whole you know Community College isn't

1013
00:50:10,430 --> 00:50:09,120
so bad but once you then go away from

1014
00:50:11,630 --> 00:50:10,440
that and say you're in graduate school

1015
00:50:13,220 --> 00:50:11,640
with a bunch of

1016
00:50:15,680 --> 00:50:13,230
other doctoral candidates and they're

1017
00:50:18,920 --> 00:50:15,690
all you know they've had a different

1018
00:50:22,160 --> 00:50:18,930
maybe way through it than you have you

1019
00:50:23,720 --> 00:50:22,170
start to see some of the in justices and

1020
00:50:27,230 --> 00:50:23,730
the elitism at play and then with the

1021
00:50:28,460 --> 00:50:27,240
professors and so it was it was I felt

1022
00:50:30,290 --> 00:50:28,470
like a double agent

1023
00:50:34,040 --> 00:50:30,300
especially after I think it was my

1024
00:50:37,130 --> 00:50:34,050
junior year and undergraduate I

1025
00:50:38,720 --> 00:50:37,140
contacted Michael Cremo everybody I'm

1026
00:50:40,940 --> 00:50:38,730
sure is familiar with Michael Cremo I

1027
00:50:44,300 --> 00:50:40,950
well I would hope at least but I

1028
00:50:45,950 --> 00:50:44,310
contacted him to ask him you know for

1029
00:50:48,140 --> 00:50:45,960
some advice and I was surprised and

1030
00:50:49,910 --> 00:50:48,150
pleasantly surprised that he responded

1031
00:50:51,350 --> 00:50:49,920
and gave me that advice I was looking

1032
00:50:53,360 --> 00:50:51,360
for which was very helpful because at

1033
00:50:55,340 --> 00:50:53,370
the time I was getting a little

1034
00:50:57,350 --> 00:50:55,350
disenchanted with everything I thought I

1035
00:50:59,420 --> 00:50:57,360
just want to blow this popsicle stand

1036
00:51:01,850 --> 00:50:59,430
and you know just to explore some of

1037
00:51:03,590 --> 00:51:01,860
these alternative ideas but I you know

1038
00:51:06,920 --> 00:51:03,600
he essentially talked me off the ledge

1039
00:51:09,020 --> 00:51:06,930
and I stayed in school but what I did

1040
00:51:12,950 --> 00:51:09,030
was I looked at it as a an opportunity

1041
00:51:15,110 --> 00:51:12,960
to do sort of you know I guess spy

1042
00:51:16,790 --> 00:51:15,120
double agent sort of thing you know so I

1043
00:51:19,070 --> 00:51:16,800
thought when I get out of this I'm

1044
00:51:23,480 --> 00:51:19,080
taking all the skills that I'm acquiring

1045
00:51:25,280 --> 00:51:23,490
here and I'm going to use them for in my

1046
00:51:27,260 --> 00:51:25,290
mind that the better of course if you

1047
00:51:29,540 --> 00:51:27,270
ask my former professors they would say

1048
00:51:31,010 --> 00:51:29,550
I went to the dark side but you know

1049
00:51:33,460 --> 00:51:31,020
that's that's the difference in

1050
00:51:36,260 --> 00:51:33,470
perspective right did you ever consider

1051
00:51:38,510 --> 00:51:36,270
the straight and narrow and staying on

1052
00:51:41,300 --> 00:51:38,520
the other side of the fence in academia

1053
00:51:43,550 --> 00:51:41,310
I did I I really did because at that

1054
00:51:46,640 --> 00:51:43,560
what I started doing was community

1055
00:51:48,560 --> 00:51:46,650
archaeology as I worked in downtown

1056
00:51:50,030 --> 00:51:48,570
Cleveland on a lot of excavations which

1057
00:51:52,280 --> 00:51:50,040
sounds kind of weird like what would be

1058
00:51:54,080 --> 00:51:52,290
in downtown Cleveland well a lot it was

1059
00:51:57,700 --> 00:51:54,090
quite fascinating to work in an urban

1060
00:51:59,930 --> 00:51:57,710
environment and I used to help out with

1061
00:52:02,660 --> 00:51:59,940
different a program they had for

1062
00:52:04,520 --> 00:52:02,670
inner-city youth to get involved in

1063
00:52:06,320 --> 00:52:04,530
archaeology and learn their own you know

1064
00:52:08,480 --> 00:52:06,330
cultural past and these sorts of things

1065
00:52:10,820 --> 00:52:08,490
and so I've always had a passion for

1066
00:52:12,680 --> 00:52:10,830
public involvement in archaeology and

1067
00:52:16,040 --> 00:52:12,690
history and so I did want to go into

1068
00:52:19,910 --> 00:52:16,050
teaching but it just it wasn't where I

1069
00:52:22,310 --> 00:52:19,920
felt that I would be my my most helpful

1070
00:52:24,170 --> 00:52:22,320
I mean I I still actually go and I work

1071
00:52:25,339 --> 00:52:24,180
a few places at some local historical

1072
00:52:27,799 --> 00:52:25,349
societies and

1073
00:52:29,779 --> 00:52:27,809
things like that and it's also a really

1074
00:52:32,870 --> 00:52:29,789
that's that's a disaster it's such a

1075
00:52:34,239 --> 00:52:32,880
tragedy the last one I worked for as a

1076
00:52:36,999 --> 00:52:34,249
consultant

1077
00:52:39,380 --> 00:52:37,009
let me just say if anyone wants to help

1078
00:52:42,710 --> 00:52:39,390
archaeology if anyone wants to help the

1079
00:52:44,150 --> 00:52:42,720
the the efforts to know our past and

1080
00:52:45,950 --> 00:52:44,160
preserve our past and they feel they

1081
00:52:48,680 --> 00:52:45,960
can't really do anything go to your

1082
00:52:50,329 --> 00:52:48,690
local Historical Society just the local

1083
00:52:52,400 --> 00:52:50,339
little you know organization and

1084
00:52:53,900 --> 00:52:52,410
volunteer do anything you can that's

1085
00:52:56,089 --> 00:52:53,910
where it starts is at the local level

1086
00:53:00,440 --> 00:52:56,099
because a lot of our local historical

1087
00:53:02,779 --> 00:53:00,450
societies they have amazing amazing data

1088
00:53:04,249 --> 00:53:02,789
and it's being just lost because a lot

1089
00:53:06,950 --> 00:53:04,259
of them don't they just don't have the

1090
00:53:08,930 --> 00:53:06,960
the income or the volunteering or just

1091
00:53:11,479 --> 00:53:08,940
there's this sort of lack of interest

1092
00:53:14,839 --> 00:53:11,489
that people are showing in their history

1093
00:53:16,579 --> 00:53:14,849
so I see it crumbling I see it crumbling

1094
00:53:17,989 --> 00:53:16,589
around us and it's quite sad so I've

1095
00:53:20,690 --> 00:53:17,999
done a lot of working with local

1096
00:53:22,700 --> 00:53:20,700
historical societies to try to clean up

1097
00:53:24,559 --> 00:53:22,710
their archives maybe digitize things and

1098
00:53:26,269 --> 00:53:24,569
get that out into the public so that

1099
00:53:28,700 --> 00:53:26,279
people can research these things because

1100
00:53:30,799 --> 00:53:28,710
there's hidden gems all around us all

1101
00:53:33,200 --> 00:53:30,809
around America but you know a lot of us

1102
00:53:36,109 --> 00:53:33,210
can't even get get to see these things I

1103
00:53:38,120 --> 00:53:36,119
mean boxes and boxes stacked and in

1104
00:53:41,209 --> 00:53:38,130
anything I've seen him rotting in barns

1105
00:53:43,549 --> 00:53:41,219
and and in basements and and just it's

1106
00:53:45,289 --> 00:53:43,559
amazing so there's a lot of work to be

1107
00:53:47,359 --> 00:53:45,299
done in history and and it seems that

1108
00:53:49,370 --> 00:53:47,369
the historians and archaeologists the

1109
00:53:51,469 --> 00:53:49,380
people who are charged with doing this

1110
00:53:54,289 --> 00:53:51,479
in the public trust mind you most of the

1111
00:53:56,450 --> 00:53:54,299
time they're getting paid by taxpayer

1112
00:53:58,640 --> 00:53:56,460
dollars they're not doing this they're

1113
00:54:02,900 --> 00:53:58,650
not reaching out to the public and so

1114
00:54:04,579 --> 00:54:02,910
it's it's a it's a tragedy and so they

1115
00:54:07,609 --> 00:54:04,589
really have no right to complain when

1116
00:54:08,719 --> 00:54:07,619
people enjoy documentaries and and all

1117
00:54:10,430 --> 00:54:08,729
these different things that are reaching

1118
00:54:12,499 --> 00:54:10,440
out to them to teach them because nobody

1119
00:54:15,109 --> 00:54:12,509
else is teaching anybody it seems yeah

1120
00:54:17,839 --> 00:54:15,119
and the thought of what is in the

1121
00:54:20,420 --> 00:54:17,849
basements of the museums around the

1122
00:54:23,539 --> 00:54:20,430
world that have been you know stored

1123
00:54:27,799 --> 00:54:23,549
away in boxes and completely forgotten

1124
00:54:30,170 --> 00:54:27,809
I mean the the amount of manpower it

1125
00:54:31,940 --> 00:54:30,180
would take to go and check this stuff

1126
00:54:35,420 --> 00:54:31,950
out they just recently found in the

1127
00:54:39,079 --> 00:54:35,430
Cairo Museum in the basement the model

1128
00:54:44,509 --> 00:54:39,089
of King Tut's boat right and they do

1129
00:54:46,729 --> 00:54:44,519
even though they had it you know they

1130
00:54:49,370 --> 00:54:46,739
put that on it was it was you know

1131
00:54:51,170 --> 00:54:49,380
headline news last week but they only

1132
00:54:52,999 --> 00:54:51,180
found it because they built the new

1133
00:54:55,130 --> 00:54:53,009
museum over there and they're moving the

1134
00:54:57,709 --> 00:54:55,140
museum from one building to the other

1135
00:55:01,190 --> 00:54:57,719
you know to the new grand Cairo Museum

1136
00:55:03,559 --> 00:55:01,200
and they found it in a box and it had

1137
00:55:08,450 --> 00:55:03,569
and and it wrapped in a newspaper I

1138
00:55:10,579 --> 00:55:08,460
believe from 1932 so probably wrapped up

1139
00:55:11,269 --> 00:55:10,589
by Howard Carter himself put in the box

1140
00:55:15,589 --> 00:55:11,279
and forgotten

1141
00:55:17,839 --> 00:55:15,599
Wow what would it take you know because

1142
00:55:19,519 --> 00:55:17,849
we have all this excitement with you

1143
00:55:22,309 --> 00:55:19,529
know gobekli tepe and the stuff that's

1144
00:55:22,729 --> 00:55:22,319
going on in Peru and and and and around

1145
00:55:27,309 --> 00:55:22,739
the world

1146
00:55:30,380 --> 00:55:27,319
what would it take for something to blow

1147
00:55:32,989 --> 00:55:30,390
history's doors off you know I mean the

1148
00:55:36,680 --> 00:55:32,999
paradigm shift in everything whether

1149
00:55:41,109 --> 00:55:36,690
it's its religious or its et HOF world

1150
00:55:45,620 --> 00:55:41,119
related or or para like just some crazy

1151
00:55:47,630 --> 00:55:45,630
atlantis if if that happened would they

1152
00:55:51,680 --> 00:55:47,640
announce it would they announce a

1153
00:55:56,329 --> 00:55:51,690
game-changer well I have a very specific

1154
00:55:58,039 --> 00:55:56,339
answer to this and my answer is we

1155
00:56:00,559 --> 00:55:58,049
wouldn't get that information we

1156
00:56:04,819 --> 00:56:00,569
wouldn't even know it because they would

1157
00:56:06,440 --> 00:56:04,829
have sort of pre-screened that so the

1158
00:56:08,390 --> 00:56:06,450
way this works it's really terrible I

1159
00:56:11,690 --> 00:56:08,400
talk about this in a lot of my previous

1160
00:56:13,819 --> 00:56:11,700
work with the sort of corruption that is

1161
00:56:16,329 --> 00:56:13,829
the academic industrial complex

1162
00:56:18,709 --> 00:56:16,339
especially in the field of archaeology

1163
00:56:21,469 --> 00:56:18,719
and in archaeology I'm sure I'll get the

1164
00:56:23,509 --> 00:56:21,479
emails but you know what stand up for

1165
00:56:25,700 --> 00:56:23,519
what's right because this is not right

1166
00:56:27,979 --> 00:56:25,710
what's going on especially in war-torn

1167
00:56:31,339 --> 00:56:27,989
countries and in the Middle East there

1168
00:56:33,079 --> 00:56:31,349
are there's a there's an idea that these

1169
00:56:35,089 --> 00:56:33,089
professors are going out and they're

1170
00:56:37,370 --> 00:56:35,099
doing this work and you know then they

1171
00:56:39,410 --> 00:56:37,380
come back and they scrub the artifacts

1172
00:56:40,670 --> 00:56:39,420
and publish papers and teach and put

1173
00:56:41,209 --> 00:56:40,680
things in museums and it's just this

1174
00:56:43,789 --> 00:56:41,219
beautiful

1175
00:56:46,130 --> 00:56:43,799
you know symbiotic no it's just not that

1176
00:56:48,020 --> 00:56:46,140
way now that's not to say that there

1177
00:56:49,970 --> 00:56:48,030
haven't been those

1178
00:56:51,980 --> 00:56:49,980
things it's just it's but that's not

1179
00:56:53,840 --> 00:56:51,990
always what happens and so when you have

1180
00:56:56,360 --> 00:56:53,850
these larger scale excavations that are

1181
00:56:58,760 --> 00:56:56,370
going on in politically sensitive areas

1182
00:57:01,280 --> 00:56:58,770
where there maybe could be something

1183
00:57:03,740 --> 00:57:01,290
found that is a game changer they are

1184
00:57:04,820 --> 00:57:03,750
they have that tightly locked we don't

1185
00:57:06,710 --> 00:57:04,830
even know about some of those

1186
00:57:10,000 --> 00:57:06,720
excavations until after the fact there's

1187
00:57:12,230 --> 00:57:10,010
secret excavations they're not funded

1188
00:57:14,570 --> 00:57:12,240
outwardly in any open in a transparent

1189
00:57:18,050 --> 00:57:14,580
way in fact they're funded oftentimes by

1190
00:57:20,870 --> 00:57:18,060
things like big oil or elite families

1191
00:57:23,090 --> 00:57:20,880
elite families who and I don't even mean

1192
00:57:25,730 --> 00:57:23,100
like Rothschild and boogeyman and stuff

1193
00:57:28,400 --> 00:57:25,740
although those types are actually

1194
00:57:32,150 --> 00:57:28,410
funding excavations but I mean actual

1195
00:57:34,550 --> 00:57:32,160
individual elites whose sole mission is

1196
00:57:37,490 --> 00:57:34,560
to get these artifacts for their

1197
00:57:39,470 --> 00:57:37,500
collection unapologetically they go out

1198
00:57:43,280 --> 00:57:39,480
and it's basically that they're hiring

1199
00:57:45,440 --> 00:57:43,290
the universities to go and shop for them

1200
00:57:47,450 --> 00:57:45,450
for these artifacts so they launder the

1201
00:57:49,190 --> 00:57:47,460
money they go and they make foundations

1202
00:57:51,200 --> 00:57:49,200
they give the Foundation's

1203
00:57:53,210 --> 00:57:51,210
money the Foundation's turn it into

1204
00:57:55,430 --> 00:57:53,220
grants then the grants go down to the

1205
00:57:58,100 --> 00:57:55,440
university the university hands that to

1206
00:57:59,690 --> 00:57:58,110
the individual research lab and then so

1207
00:58:01,220 --> 00:57:59,700
on and so on so there's so many points

1208
00:58:02,750 --> 00:58:01,230
of separation so the average person

1209
00:58:04,670 --> 00:58:02,760
they'll never know where that money came

1210
00:58:07,460 --> 00:58:04,680
from and who's actually funding these

1211
00:58:09,770 --> 00:58:07,470
these things now why that's important

1212
00:58:12,320 --> 00:58:09,780
it's because follow the money so if if

1213
00:58:15,080 --> 00:58:12,330
say I am out there in Iraq currently

1214
00:58:18,320 --> 00:58:15,090
digging and I have been funded by an

1215
00:58:22,460 --> 00:58:18,330
elite family and a global bank and Big

1216
00:58:24,170 --> 00:58:22,470
Oil and a government Intelligence Agency

1217
00:58:26,360 --> 00:58:24,180
which these are all examples that are

1218
00:58:29,080 --> 00:58:26,370
true if I am out there and I'm digging

1219
00:58:31,490 --> 00:58:29,090
and I find something absolutely

1220
00:58:33,470 --> 00:58:31,500
game-changing a tablet that has

1221
00:58:36,710 --> 00:58:33,480
something on it that says exactly where

1222
00:58:40,520 --> 00:58:36,720
we came from or an artifact that that

1223
00:58:42,260 --> 00:58:40,530
defies all physical laws something that

1224
00:58:44,540 --> 00:58:42,270
just does not fit at all and it's just

1225
00:58:46,460 --> 00:58:44,550
amazing there's just no way anyone's

1226
00:58:49,460 --> 00:58:46,470
gonna know about that hue what am I

1227
00:58:52,850 --> 00:58:49,470
gonna do I have to give it up to you

1228
00:58:54,980 --> 00:58:52,860
know who's paying the bills there you

1229
00:58:57,320 --> 00:58:54,990
can't exactly put it in your pocket you

1230
00:58:58,940 --> 00:58:57,330
can't put it in your pocket yeah there's

1231
00:59:00,560 --> 00:58:58,950
nothing you have to report this you have

1232
00:59:01,790 --> 00:59:00,570
to do and so what will happen at that

1233
00:59:04,670 --> 00:59:01,800
point with this am a

1234
00:59:06,560 --> 00:59:04,680
using game-changer well it's gonna go to

1235
00:59:08,150 --> 00:59:06,570
the highest bidder whoever has the

1236
00:59:10,280 --> 00:59:08,160
vested interest it's certainly not going

1237
00:59:12,560 --> 00:59:10,290
to go out to the public the public gets

1238
00:59:14,450 --> 00:59:12,570
little potsherds and you know little

1239
00:59:16,970 --> 00:59:14,460
bits and pieces that will look nice in a

1240
00:59:18,710 --> 00:59:16,980
museum after a couple years when the

1241
00:59:20,030 --> 00:59:18,720
excavation is over and the papers have

1242
00:59:25,820 --> 00:59:20,040
been written and there's nothing to see

1243
00:59:28,070 --> 00:59:25,830
here folks move it along we have to take

1244
00:59:30,620 --> 00:59:28,080
a break right here on that note all

1245
00:59:33,140 --> 00:59:30,630
right our guest tonight dr. heather Lynn

1246
00:59:37,190 --> 00:59:33,150
holding it up to the cameras right here

1247
00:59:40,640 --> 00:59:37,200
her new book evil archeology we'll be

1248
00:59:43,160 --> 00:59:40,650
right back after this short break on the

1249
00:59:44,990 --> 00:59:43,170
game changer Network and Katie RA the

1250
00:59:45,880 --> 00:59:45,000
planet I'm your signature stay with us

1251
01:00:09,190 --> 00:59:45,890
we'll be right back

1252
01:00:13,160 --> 01:00:11,030
this is fade to black

1253
01:00:16,850 --> 01:00:13,170
with Jimmy Church on the game changer

1254
01:00:18,640 --> 01:00:16,860
radio network and kgr a the global radio

1255
01:00:21,950 --> 01:00:18,650
alliance

1256
01:00:25,280 --> 01:00:21,960
this is kera digital broadcasting

1257
01:00:26,930 --> 01:00:25,290
stations Salt Lake City Utah Van Buren

1258
01:00:28,180 --> 01:00:26,940
Arkansas

1259
01:00:30,950 --> 01:00:28,190
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Church fade to black

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on the game changer network and the kgr

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a digital broadcast station this is Toby

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Kebbell you're listening to Jimmy Church

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Church radio.com hey it's grace can we

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family and friends are asking you what

1350
01:04:36,690 --> 01:04:34,090
you did to look so good your secret will

1351
01:04:38,910 --> 01:04:36,700
be nature's Youth RSS it's time to start

1352
01:04:41,070 --> 01:04:38,920
looking better and feeling better learn

1353
01:04:43,290 --> 01:04:41,080
more in order your nature's use RSS at

1354
01:04:46,850 --> 01:04:43,300
nature's youth calm that's nature's

1355
01:04:49,410 --> 01:04:46,860
youth calm that's nature's youth calm

1356
01:04:51,690 --> 01:04:49,420
hello this is Serena right kayla from

1357
01:04:54,210 --> 01:04:51,700
conscious life Expo and you're listening

1358
01:04:56,460 --> 01:04:54,220
to fade to black with Jimmy Church who

1359
01:05:01,220 --> 01:04:56,470
holds the lucky pony record for the best

1360
01:05:03,750 --> 01:05:01,230
astrological chart since 1963 true story

1361
01:05:05,340 --> 01:05:03,760
this is Micah Hank's of the gray lien

1362
01:05:07,680 --> 01:05:05,350
report and you're listening to Jimmy

1363
01:05:08,660 --> 01:05:07,690
church on fade to black across the globe

1364
01:05:11,180 --> 01:05:08,670
on the GameChanger

1365
01:05:12,960 --> 01:05:11,190
Radio Network and the one and only kgr a

1366
01:05:16,940 --> 01:05:12,970
radio the planet

1367
01:05:17,250 --> 01:05:16,950
[Music]

1368
01:05:32,630 --> 01:05:17,260
[Applause]

1369
01:05:34,920 --> 01:05:32,640
[Music]

1370
01:05:36,420 --> 01:05:34,930
welcome back fade to black I'm he'll see

1371
01:05:43,590 --> 01:05:36,430
me Church our guest tonight dr. heather

1372
01:05:46,230 --> 01:05:43,600
Lynn her new book evil archeology demons

1373
01:05:50,210 --> 01:05:46,240
possessions and sinister relics which is

1374
01:05:52,250 --> 01:05:50,220
where I got a start right there and

1375
01:05:56,400 --> 01:05:52,260
Heather okay

1376
01:05:59,460 --> 01:05:56,410
this is this is my serious trip with all

1377
01:06:02,580 --> 01:05:59,470
of this and and I always tie in my

1378
01:06:05,940 --> 01:06:02,590
childhood and I go back and I and it's

1379
01:06:08,010 --> 01:06:05,950
still to this day the opening like ten

1380
01:06:11,580 --> 01:06:08,020
minutes of The Exorcist or the opening

1381
01:06:13,770 --> 01:06:11,590
ten minutes of The Omen really set the

1382
01:06:15,390 --> 01:06:13,780
stage when we start to think about what

1383
01:06:17,430 --> 01:06:15,400
you know what was buried around the

1384
01:06:20,040 --> 01:06:17,440
world in the archaeology that goes along

1385
01:06:22,530 --> 01:06:20,050
with it and what could possibly be found

1386
01:06:28,170 --> 01:06:22,540
and and what it could mean to all of

1387
01:06:31,290 --> 01:06:28,180
humanity right these things but I I feel

1388
01:06:35,700 --> 01:06:31,300
that there is some historical fact in

1389
01:06:37,560 --> 01:06:35,710
the opening to those two movies and then

1390
01:06:40,800 --> 01:06:37,570
I read this book and I'm like ah ha

1391
01:06:45,090 --> 01:06:40,810
right Hollywood didn't get it wrong for

1392
01:06:47,970 --> 01:06:45,100
once is there some truth to that I think

1393
01:06:49,220 --> 01:06:47,980
so I mean in a way in a strange way I

1394
01:06:51,780 --> 01:06:49,230
think this book might have been a

1395
01:06:56,310 --> 01:06:51,790
strange love letter to those types of

1396
01:06:59,010 --> 01:06:56,320
movies they've they kind of they

1397
01:07:01,470 --> 01:06:59,020
motivated me when I was younger to look

1398
01:07:03,510 --> 01:07:01,480
at some of these darker questions I was

1399
01:07:05,070 --> 01:07:03,520
brought up Catholic and so of course I

1400
01:07:07,830 --> 01:07:05,080
wasn't supposed to watch The Exorcist

1401
01:07:09,450 --> 01:07:07,840
and of course then I did probably it too

1402
01:07:11,130 --> 01:07:09,460
young of an age I think so

1403
01:07:12,870 --> 01:07:11,140
it really affected me in the omen as

1404
01:07:14,550 --> 01:07:12,880
well that was quite frightening but

1405
01:07:16,710 --> 01:07:14,560
those things stood out to me and it

1406
01:07:20,340 --> 01:07:16,720
wasn't actually until much later that I

1407
01:07:22,680 --> 01:07:20,350
saw The Exorcist again as an adult and

1408
01:07:24,300 --> 01:07:22,690
already a professional that it sort of

1409
01:07:26,010 --> 01:07:24,310
hit me it resonated with me in a

1410
01:07:28,050 --> 01:07:26,020
different way that hey wait a minute

1411
01:07:29,970 --> 01:07:28,060
this is what does the archaeology have

1412
01:07:33,270 --> 01:07:29,980
to do with this whole bit and so it

1413
01:07:35,280 --> 01:07:33,280
piqued my interest even more and it

1414
01:07:37,890 --> 01:07:35,290
wasn't long after seeing it again on

1415
01:07:40,860 --> 01:07:37,900
cable television sort of playing you

1416
01:07:44,220 --> 01:07:40,870
know the background that I came across a

1417
01:07:46,350 --> 01:07:44,230
strange news story out of North Carolina

1418
01:07:51,140 --> 01:07:46,360
in 2014

1419
01:07:54,450 --> 01:07:51,150
it was a man who had been murdering and

1420
01:07:57,510 --> 01:07:54,460
cannibalizing neighbors and burying them

1421
01:07:59,460 --> 01:07:57,520
in his backyard actually I should say

1422
01:08:02,280 --> 01:07:59,470
his mother's backyard he lived in his

1423
01:08:05,130 --> 01:08:02,290
mother's home and so it was kind of a

1424
01:08:07,260 --> 01:08:05,140
you know typical gruesome crime story

1425
01:08:12,630 --> 01:08:07,270
but what wasn't typical was that his

1426
01:08:14,820 --> 01:08:12,640
name was Pazuzu are you serious okay

1427
01:08:18,480 --> 01:08:14,830
wait wait wait hold on for the audience

1428
01:08:20,670 --> 01:08:18,490
who's Pazuzu is the gentleman on the

1429
01:08:21,630 --> 01:08:20,680
cover I mean the demon on the cover of

1430
01:08:26,310 --> 01:08:21,640
my book

1431
01:08:28,800 --> 01:08:26,320
he is a Mesopotamian demon the demon of

1432
01:08:31,470 --> 01:08:28,810
the southwestern wind it is the demon

1433
01:08:34,760 --> 01:08:31,480
from the movie The Exorcist that you'll

1434
01:08:38,370 --> 01:08:34,770
see in the opening scene and he's quite

1435
01:08:40,200 --> 01:08:38,380
obscene looking and frightening and he

1436
01:08:42,630 --> 01:08:40,210
is the demon who then goes on and is

1437
01:08:44,250 --> 01:08:42,640
responsible for the possession of the

1438
01:08:46,079 --> 01:08:44,260
main character in the movie The Exorcist

1439
01:08:46,980 --> 01:08:46,089
but it's an actual demon from

1440
01:08:49,200 --> 01:08:46,990
Mesopotamia

1441
01:08:51,360 --> 01:08:49,210
so the William Peter Blatty got that

1442
01:08:53,640 --> 01:08:51,370
absolutely correct in his book and of

1443
01:08:58,530 --> 01:08:53,650
course the movie and so that demon

1444
01:09:00,960 --> 01:08:58,540
Pazuzu is what this man's name was he he

1445
01:09:02,579 --> 01:09:00,970
was originally John Lawson and he would

1446
01:09:05,520 --> 01:09:02,589
grew up in just suburbs in North

1447
01:09:08,310 --> 01:09:05,530
Carolina and after struggling with clear

1448
01:09:10,520 --> 01:09:08,320
mental health issues he went on to

1449
01:09:13,020 --> 01:09:10,530
recruit sort of a Brotherhood of

1450
01:09:15,060 --> 01:09:13,030
disenfranchised people and he got a

1451
01:09:18,680 --> 01:09:15,070
girlfriend and one of her friends to

1452
01:09:23,340 --> 01:09:18,690
help him do these things as a way to

1453
01:09:26,040 --> 01:09:23,350
worship Pazuzu and honor Pazuzu and so

1454
01:09:27,810 --> 01:09:26,050
he had this idea that the Sumerian

1455
01:09:31,349 --> 01:09:27,820
religion involved a monthly blood

1456
01:09:32,880 --> 01:09:31,359
sacrifice the first of course of a small

1457
01:09:35,370 --> 01:09:32,890
animal until he worked his way up to

1458
01:09:37,050 --> 01:09:35,380
humans but he had to perform these

1459
01:09:41,280 --> 01:09:37,060
rituals during what he called the Black

1460
01:09:43,950 --> 01:09:41,290
Moon in order to appease Pazuzu and so

1461
01:09:44,490 --> 01:09:43,960
it's quite a weird story I mean to say

1462
01:09:46,500 --> 01:09:44,500
the least

1463
01:09:49,620 --> 01:09:46,510
but I started looking at this it really

1464
01:09:51,740 --> 01:09:49,630
struck me as as eerie and it probably of

1465
01:09:54,660 --> 01:09:51,750
course because of my interest in the

1466
01:09:56,130 --> 01:09:54,670
movie The Exorcist and so I started

1467
01:09:58,350 --> 01:09:56,140
looking more into it and I found

1468
01:09:59,490 --> 01:09:58,360
pictures and video that had been taken

1469
01:10:01,380 --> 01:09:59,500
from the inside of his

1470
01:10:02,730 --> 01:10:01,390
his mother's house and it was it was

1471
01:10:04,920 --> 01:10:02,740
just so disturbing

1472
01:10:07,710 --> 01:10:04,930
there were Sumerian markings and occult

1473
01:10:09,810 --> 01:10:07,720
symbols all over the walls and ceilings

1474
01:10:12,240 --> 01:10:09,820
of his living room they were cut out

1475
01:10:14,790 --> 01:10:12,250
pictures of sumerian demons and Anunnaki

1476
01:10:17,150 --> 01:10:14,800
pinned all over the walls his kitchen

1477
01:10:19,350 --> 01:10:17,160
was filthy and it's where he had

1478
01:10:20,070 --> 01:10:19,360
prepared the victims body for

1479
01:10:22,980 --> 01:10:20,080
consumption

1480
01:10:25,380 --> 01:10:22,990
he had demonic imagery all over that

1481
01:10:27,660 --> 01:10:25,390
strips of flight tape covered in dead

1482
01:10:29,910 --> 01:10:27,670
flies hanging from above like hellish

1483
01:10:30,450 --> 01:10:29,920
party streamers and when he left the

1484
01:10:32,910 --> 01:10:30,460
kitchen

1485
01:10:35,160 --> 01:10:32,920
it was ankle-deep garbage lining the

1486
01:10:37,740 --> 01:10:35,170
halls leading to bedrooms that were just

1487
01:10:40,140 --> 01:10:37,750
piled high with more grime and clutter

1488
01:10:43,170 --> 01:10:40,150
and still more Anunnaki and demon

1489
01:10:44,610 --> 01:10:43,180
imagery everywhere and so it was it was

1490
01:10:46,680 --> 01:10:44,620
just really disturbing to say the least

1491
01:10:48,630 --> 01:10:46,690
but he was arrested and charged with

1492
01:10:50,130 --> 01:10:48,640
first-degree murder he and his

1493
01:10:53,040 --> 01:10:50,140
girlfriend and the female friend were

1494
01:10:55,680 --> 01:10:53,050
they were all charged with various you

1495
01:10:58,620 --> 01:10:55,690
know charges but about 3:00 in the

1496
01:11:00,840 --> 01:10:58,630
morning some days after the guards at

1497
01:11:02,490 --> 01:11:00,850
the prison where he was and Rolly found

1498
01:11:04,890 --> 01:11:02,500
him in a pool of his own blood in his

1499
01:11:06,600 --> 01:11:04,900
cell and the autopsy report showed he

1500
01:11:08,400 --> 01:11:06,610
had cut his left arm on the inside of

1501
01:11:10,800 --> 01:11:08,410
his elbow like he was trying to cut his

1502
01:11:12,660 --> 01:11:10,810
arm off the report said he had

1503
01:11:14,610 --> 01:11:12,670
perforated his left brachial artery

1504
01:11:17,370 --> 01:11:14,620
which was most likely what caused him to

1505
01:11:20,430 --> 01:11:17,380
just bleed out but aside from that he

1506
01:11:22,590 --> 01:11:20,440
had many deep scratches on his chest arm

1507
01:11:25,680 --> 01:11:22,600
and scalp and even rib fractures

1508
01:11:28,530 --> 01:11:25,690
although he was alone in a Cell and the

1509
01:11:31,230 --> 01:11:28,540
autopsy couldn't truly determine how he

1510
01:11:32,130 --> 01:11:31,240
got those wounds they just knew that you

1511
01:11:34,950 --> 01:11:32,140
know he bled out

1512
01:11:36,000 --> 01:11:34,960
and so they ruled it a suicide because

1513
01:11:38,820 --> 01:11:36,010
they really just had no other way to

1514
01:11:41,370 --> 01:11:38,830
rule it but before that he had begged

1515
01:11:43,740 --> 01:11:41,380
his psychiatrist to let him perform the

1516
01:11:46,350 --> 01:11:43,750
so-called Black Moon ritual to Pazuzu

1517
01:11:49,770 --> 01:11:46,360
fearing that if he didn't he would anger

1518
01:11:52,170 --> 01:11:49,780
Pazuzu and then eventually you know be

1519
01:11:54,960 --> 01:11:52,180
killed by Pazuzu even his own mother had

1520
01:11:57,540 --> 01:11:54,970
warned the police and begged them to you

1521
01:11:59,670 --> 01:11:57,550
know help his her son because he/she

1522
01:12:01,980 --> 01:11:59,680
really feared that if he wasn't able to

1523
01:12:03,360 --> 01:12:01,990
do this that he may in fact kill himself

1524
01:12:05,730 --> 01:12:03,370
it was so important to him to do this

1525
01:12:07,710 --> 01:12:05,740
ritual and so I started looking at this

1526
01:12:10,170 --> 01:12:07,720
kid this tragic tragic case and I

1527
01:12:12,510 --> 01:12:10,180
thought you know could could the Pazuzu

1528
01:12:13,290 --> 01:12:12,520
demon could it have been behind these

1529
01:12:15,630 --> 01:12:13,300
murders

1530
01:12:17,700 --> 01:12:15,640
sound right right you know I mean

1531
01:12:20,400 --> 01:12:17,710
clearly he was responsible for the death

1532
01:12:22,470 --> 01:12:20,410
of these people but I sort of thought

1533
01:12:24,510 --> 01:12:22,480
about his professed inspiration which

1534
01:12:27,060 --> 01:12:24,520
was Pazuzu he said it inspired him and I

1535
01:12:29,820 --> 01:12:27,070
thought well what you know he wasn't

1536
01:12:31,520 --> 01:12:29,830
possessed but he was inspired and so I

1537
01:12:33,960 --> 01:12:31,530
really thought about the etymology of

1538
01:12:36,390 --> 01:12:33,970
inspiration and it comes from the Latin

1539
01:12:38,790 --> 01:12:36,400
inspir are a meaning to breathe or blow

1540
01:12:41,240 --> 01:12:38,800
into and it was originally used to

1541
01:12:44,250 --> 01:12:41,250
describe when a supernatural being

1542
01:12:46,740 --> 01:12:44,260
imparts an idea onto someone so I

1543
01:12:50,100 --> 01:12:46,750
thought well what is possession then but

1544
01:12:52,260 --> 01:12:50,110
maybe an evil entity is blowing an idea

1545
01:12:54,480 --> 01:12:52,270
into somebody or maybe it going too far

1546
01:12:56,460 --> 01:12:54,490
and eventually inhabiting a willing

1547
01:12:58,920 --> 01:12:56,470
person to encourage them to do these

1548
01:13:00,000 --> 01:12:58,930
evil things and so you know I thought

1549
01:13:02,820 --> 01:13:00,010
were these criminals just

1550
01:13:05,820 --> 01:13:02,830
psychologically disturbed or maybe the

1551
01:13:07,890 --> 01:13:05,830
Pazuzu spirit found willing avatars to

1552
01:13:09,300 --> 01:13:07,900
carry out these deeds because it's just

1553
01:13:11,340 --> 01:13:09,310
the thing I kicked around for a little

1554
01:13:12,750 --> 01:13:11,350
bit and thought I think I need to look

1555
01:13:15,150 --> 01:13:12,760
into this a little further sort of the

1556
01:13:17,280 --> 01:13:15,160
origin of demons and what role they may

1557
01:13:20,370 --> 01:13:17,290
have played in ancient civilizations and

1558
01:13:23,280 --> 01:13:20,380
and sort of what role do they play now

1559
01:13:28,980 --> 01:13:23,290
if any that's what made me write the

1560
01:13:32,010 --> 01:13:28,990
book essentially see this is listening

1561
01:13:34,770 --> 01:13:32,020
to that you know we're talking about a

1562
01:13:36,720 --> 01:13:34,780
modern situation where we think all of

1563
01:13:39,330 --> 01:13:36,730
this stuff is in the past right it's

1564
01:13:41,430 --> 01:13:39,340
it's it was a different era when this

1565
01:13:45,060 --> 01:13:41,440
kind of stuff went down clearly this was

1566
01:13:47,370 --> 01:13:45,070
2014 but let me ask you this let's let's

1567
01:13:51,030 --> 01:13:47,380
suppose something here how do you get

1568
01:13:52,530 --> 01:13:51,040
rid of his story right you don't want a

1569
01:13:54,480 --> 01:13:52,540
public you don't want that coming to a

1570
01:13:57,300 --> 01:13:54,490
theater near you you don't want other

1571
01:14:01,680 --> 01:13:57,310
people to be inspired but oh by what he

1572
01:14:04,590 --> 01:14:01,690
had done and so do we bury it do we bury

1573
01:14:06,870 --> 01:14:04,600
his body do his house do we tear it do

1574
01:14:09,660 --> 01:14:06,880
we bet you know what I mean do we hide

1575
01:14:11,400 --> 01:14:09,670
all of the evidence you know buried in

1576
01:14:15,090 --> 01:14:11,410
the ground burn it

1577
01:14:18,020 --> 01:14:15,100
and get rid of it like they did in the

1578
01:14:21,720 --> 01:14:18,030
past when something like this happened

1579
01:14:24,900 --> 01:14:21,730
when they thought that the local village

1580
01:14:29,790 --> 01:14:24,910
girl or boy was possessed by what did

1581
01:14:31,770 --> 01:14:29,800
they do right they would is is is this

1582
01:14:34,970 --> 01:14:31,780
been going on throughout history this is

1583
01:14:39,210 --> 01:14:34,980
exactly what you wrote about in the book

1584
01:14:41,190 --> 01:14:39,220
yes that that is they they would yet

1585
01:14:43,350 --> 01:14:41,200
they didn't want to have other people be

1586
01:14:45,510 --> 01:14:43,360
inspired I think really that does come

1587
01:14:48,900 --> 01:14:45,520
down to it so like copycat killer or or

1588
01:14:50,490 --> 01:14:48,910
anything but they maybe they thought of

1589
01:14:52,560 --> 01:14:50,500
it in those terms or maybe they actually

1590
01:14:55,350 --> 01:14:52,570
thought of it in the terms of spirit

1591
01:14:57,240 --> 01:14:55,360
possession it's really hard to say but

1592
01:14:58,980 --> 01:14:57,250
that's that's one of these blurry lines

1593
01:15:01,260 --> 01:14:58,990
where it's like well it may be about

1594
01:15:04,050 --> 01:15:01,270
semantics at the end of the day but I

1595
01:15:06,870 --> 01:15:04,060
think it really does have real

1596
01:15:09,180 --> 01:15:06,880
consequences for people this idea of

1597
01:15:10,710 --> 01:15:09,190
evil and demons and spirits and these

1598
01:15:12,870 --> 01:15:10,720
sorts of things so I mean if you were to

1599
01:15:14,790 --> 01:15:12,880
ask the mother of the victims in North

1600
01:15:16,980 --> 01:15:14,800
Carolina they would they would probably

1601
01:15:18,840 --> 01:15:16,990
have a far different answer but so what

1602
01:15:21,240 --> 01:15:18,850
how ill is real what is it what does it

1603
01:15:22,890 --> 01:15:21,250
take to make something you know real

1604
01:15:26,820 --> 01:15:22,900
that way and so all throughout history

1605
01:15:29,820 --> 01:15:26,830
we've had examples of cultures having

1606
01:15:33,420 --> 01:15:29,830
this relationship with demons in some

1607
01:15:35,180 --> 01:15:33,430
way and and it goes very far back I mean

1608
01:15:38,940 --> 01:15:35,190
and in the book I discussed the

1609
01:15:41,330 --> 01:15:38,950
prehistoric idea of demons so we have a

1610
01:15:43,740 --> 01:15:41,340
lot of evidence to suggest that even

1611
01:15:46,200 --> 01:15:43,750
prehistoric shamans we're doing

1612
01:15:48,210 --> 01:15:46,210
exorcisms in the form of trepan II or

1613
01:15:50,040 --> 01:15:48,220
drilling a hole in somebody's head and

1614
01:15:52,620 --> 01:15:50,050
so we have this idea that there are

1615
01:15:54,450 --> 01:15:52,630
these spirits in the head and we need to

1616
01:15:56,160 --> 01:15:54,460
get them out and so you know you see

1617
01:15:57,720 --> 01:15:56,170
that but that's again you know with

1618
01:15:59,310 --> 01:15:57,730
archaeology everything's ritual and

1619
01:16:01,590 --> 01:15:59,320
everything sort of conjecture that way

1620
01:16:05,910 --> 01:16:01,600
so but it but we do then have at least

1621
01:16:08,750 --> 01:16:05,920
in the sumerian records you know clear

1622
01:16:13,260 --> 01:16:08,760
evidence some of the best evidence of

1623
01:16:15,480 --> 01:16:13,270
exorcism so in so we have going four

1624
01:16:18,720 --> 01:16:15,490
thousand years ago we have Sumerian

1625
01:16:20,430 --> 01:16:18,730
cuneiform tablets that outline just line

1626
01:16:22,440 --> 01:16:20,440
by line what an exorcism is supposed to

1627
01:16:24,750 --> 01:16:22,450
look like and they appear these these

1628
01:16:26,100 --> 01:16:24,760
rites appear very similar to those of

1629
01:16:28,260 --> 01:16:26,110
the Catholic Church or something we

1630
01:16:32,060 --> 01:16:28,270
recognized today in pop culture though

1631
01:16:35,360 --> 01:16:32,070
and so in Sumer they

1632
01:16:37,910 --> 01:16:35,370
had scribes and a university system in a

1633
01:16:39,260 --> 01:16:37,920
way they were very advanced and they had

1634
01:16:42,020 --> 01:16:39,270
an advanced system of training

1635
01:16:44,750 --> 01:16:42,030
professionals and so because of that

1636
01:16:46,790 --> 01:16:44,760
they had textbooks and as a result of

1637
01:16:47,960 --> 01:16:46,800
that we know what they taught them so

1638
01:16:50,540 --> 01:16:47,970
there's still these textbooks available

1639
01:16:52,880 --> 01:16:50,550
they're in tablet form of course but we

1640
01:16:54,110 --> 01:16:52,890
have many many things to look at to

1641
01:16:55,970 --> 01:16:54,120
understand what it was that they were

1642
01:16:58,400 --> 01:16:55,980
teaching there they're physicians at the

1643
01:17:00,710 --> 01:16:58,410
time their physicians their medical

1644
01:17:02,840 --> 01:17:00,720
physicians were being taught exorcisms

1645
01:17:04,490 --> 01:17:02,850
they didn't sort of separate the body

1646
01:17:07,370 --> 01:17:04,500
and mind back then it was sort of just

1647
01:17:10,370 --> 01:17:07,380
one so it was the job of the doctor to

1648
01:17:13,040 --> 01:17:10,380
also do the exorcisms and so the roughly

1649
01:17:14,990 --> 01:17:13,050
right now of the roughly 1,000 cuneiform

1650
01:17:18,410 --> 01:17:15,000
tablets held by the British Museum of

1651
01:17:21,440 --> 01:17:18,420
these medical texts 660 of them

1652
01:17:24,890 --> 01:17:21,450
specifically reference exorcism exorcism

1653
01:17:28,280 --> 01:17:24,900
in a recognizable way so we we can see

1654
01:17:30,590 --> 01:17:28,290
all sorts of things that you know it

1655
01:17:32,660 --> 01:17:30,600
goes it's just part of our human

1656
01:17:34,250 --> 01:17:32,670
experience and it has taken many

1657
01:17:36,290 --> 01:17:34,260
different shapes and forms and in some

1658
01:17:39,200 --> 01:17:36,300
ways it would be recognizable in some

1659
01:17:41,810 --> 01:17:39,210
ways not but definitely the Sumerian

1660
01:17:44,000 --> 01:17:41,820
exorcisms I believe wearing a big

1661
01:17:46,940 --> 01:17:44,010
inspiration for the way that we look at

1662
01:17:49,070 --> 01:17:46,950
exorcisms today and also medicine in

1663
01:17:51,560 --> 01:17:49,080
some ways one of the reasons that they

1664
01:17:53,510 --> 01:17:51,570
at the priest and popular culture or

1665
01:17:56,030 --> 01:17:53,520
actually just in the Catholic Rite of

1666
01:17:57,860 --> 01:17:56,040
exorcism and many others that you would

1667
01:17:59,840 --> 01:17:57,870
demand to know the name of the demon

1668
01:18:02,810 --> 01:17:59,850
that actually comes from the Sumerian

1669
01:18:05,240 --> 01:18:02,820
text as well in the Sumerian text it

1670
01:18:06,680 --> 01:18:05,250
instructed the physicians to demand to

1671
01:18:07,970 --> 01:18:06,690
know the name of the demon try to figure

1672
01:18:10,400 --> 01:18:07,980
it out it was so important because

1673
01:18:12,890 --> 01:18:10,410
essentially the name of the demon was

1674
01:18:14,900 --> 01:18:12,900
the diagnosis because today we'd say

1675
01:18:16,850 --> 01:18:14,910
cancer they would say oh well that's you

1676
01:18:18,530 --> 01:18:16,860
have a case of Pazuzu you know and so

1677
01:18:20,690 --> 01:18:18,540
they would know that how to cure it from

1678
01:18:22,880 --> 01:18:20,700
from that and it wasn't and the demons

1679
01:18:25,580 --> 01:18:22,890
weren't always bad they were sort of

1680
01:18:26,960 --> 01:18:25,590
they had were bad and possibly good or

1681
01:18:29,810 --> 01:18:26,970
at least they could be used for good

1682
01:18:32,120 --> 01:18:29,820
again with the case of Pazuzu which you

1683
01:18:34,790 --> 01:18:32,130
know we see his his imagery a lot

1684
01:18:36,560 --> 01:18:34,800
because there were so many artifacts of

1685
01:18:39,500 --> 01:18:36,570
Pazuzu dug up because people actually

1686
01:18:41,210 --> 01:18:39,510
wanted to have these amulets so you

1687
01:18:42,680 --> 01:18:41,220
wouldn't want anything to do with Pazuzu

1688
01:18:45,000 --> 01:18:42,690
he's very scary but if you're a pregnant

1689
01:18:48,240 --> 01:18:45,010
woman or a new mother you would

1690
01:18:50,069 --> 01:18:48,250
we want to have a Pazuzu amulet or even

1691
01:18:52,259 --> 01:18:50,079
a plaque beside your bed or by your

1692
01:18:55,799 --> 01:18:52,269
baby's bed to protect you from

1693
01:18:58,759 --> 01:18:55,809
Pazuzu angry jealous and barren wife

1694
01:19:01,799 --> 01:18:58,769
lamashtu who was known to go and cause

1695
01:19:03,660 --> 01:19:01,809
miscarriage and sudden infant death and

1696
01:19:06,240 --> 01:19:03,670
so what you do is you'd make sure that

1697
01:19:08,279 --> 01:19:06,250
the husband Azusa was around so that he

1698
01:19:08,879 --> 01:19:08,289
would literally with his wife into

1699
01:19:10,830 --> 01:19:08,889
submission

1700
01:19:12,660 --> 01:19:10,840
and so there's depictions of this one of

1701
01:19:14,700 --> 01:19:12,670
which is called the they didn't call it

1702
01:19:18,270 --> 01:19:14,710
the help lack it's at the Paris Museum

1703
01:19:20,129 --> 01:19:18,280
and it shows this whole exorcism scene

1704
01:19:23,370 --> 01:19:20,139
and in the underworld you see the

1705
01:19:25,740 --> 01:19:23,380
lamashtu kind of going to get the the

1706
01:19:28,020 --> 01:19:25,750
infant and then you see Pazuzu behinds

1707
01:19:31,470 --> 01:19:28,030
whipping or like get away get away demon

1708
01:19:33,180 --> 01:19:31,480
so yeah it's a they had a very complex

1709
01:19:37,279 --> 01:19:33,190
relationship with these entities it

1710
01:19:39,479 --> 01:19:37,289
wasn't all bad well I want to I want to

1711
01:19:45,089 --> 01:19:39,489
well I've got two questions but the

1712
01:19:48,540 --> 01:19:45,099
first thing I want to get to the the

1713
01:19:51,000 --> 01:19:48,550
village in Germany where that is a

1714
01:19:54,689 --> 01:19:51,010
pretty fascinating thing but before I

1715
01:19:58,049 --> 01:19:54,699
get to that would you would you have a

1716
01:20:01,259 --> 01:19:58,059
Pazuzu amulet and original in your own

1717
01:20:03,990 --> 01:20:01,269
home I mean is that just like you know

1718
01:20:08,220 --> 01:20:04,000
what I mean is that just is that asking

1719
01:20:11,640 --> 01:20:08,230
for for trouble or or or not you know

1720
01:20:13,500 --> 01:20:11,650
that's a that's a really great question

1721
01:20:15,600 --> 01:20:13,510
I think before I wrote this book I'd say

1722
01:20:19,850 --> 01:20:15,610
yeah why not you know cuz I'm not really

1723
01:20:22,470 --> 01:20:19,860
that superstitious but I think after

1724
01:20:25,290 --> 01:20:22,480
writing the book and not not necessarily

1725
01:20:26,970 --> 01:20:25,300
because of what I researched but because

1726
01:20:29,759 --> 01:20:26,980
of my experiences and some of the

1727
01:20:32,129 --> 01:20:29,769
conversations I had with people while

1728
01:20:33,660 --> 01:20:32,139
writing this book that maybe maybe there

1729
01:20:38,100 --> 01:20:33,670
is some truth to some of these things

1730
01:20:39,959 --> 01:20:38,110
being bad juju or something but even if

1731
01:20:41,939 --> 01:20:39,969
it's just something of a subconscious

1732
01:20:44,270 --> 01:20:41,949
nature where you're you know imprinting

1733
01:20:46,979 --> 01:20:44,280
that out there I'm not really sure but

1734
01:20:48,299 --> 01:20:46,989
yeah I don't think I would want to have

1735
01:20:50,189 --> 01:20:48,309
it sitting around looking at me although

1736
01:20:51,810 --> 01:20:50,199
I don't know that I could say that I

1737
01:20:53,939 --> 01:20:51,820
have a very good scientific reason for

1738
01:20:55,299 --> 01:20:53,949
that but at this point yeah I wouldn't

1739
01:20:57,909 --> 01:20:55,309
want it looking at me yeah

1740
01:21:01,419 --> 01:20:57,919
you're on a diggin in Israel right and

1741
01:21:04,149 --> 01:21:01,429
and you're there and and you you you

1742
01:21:06,309 --> 01:21:04,159
unearth one of these and the guy from

1743
01:21:07,929 --> 01:21:06,319
the Smithsonian or for Harvard or

1744
01:21:14,229 --> 01:21:07,939
whoever who's running the dick comes up

1745
01:21:17,619 --> 01:21:14,239
you know what keep it I mean you know

1746
01:21:20,049 --> 01:21:17,629
what I mean some 2,000 3,000 year old

1747
01:21:24,549 --> 01:21:20,059
and you don't know where it's been

1748
01:21:26,770 --> 01:21:24,559
Pazuzu necklace or statue do you take

1749
01:21:31,149 --> 01:21:26,780
that home I would I you know what I just

1750
01:21:33,309 --> 01:21:31,159
wouldn't I I think I would I don't think

1751
01:21:36,159 --> 01:21:33,319
I would you know ethics aside I don't

1752
01:21:38,409 --> 01:21:36,169
think I would want to do that I mean

1753
01:21:42,309 --> 01:21:38,419
just yeah because you just never know

1754
01:21:45,489 --> 01:21:42,319
right I don't think I would I don't

1755
01:21:49,119 --> 01:21:45,499
think I would yeah you know I've seen

1756
01:21:53,079 --> 01:21:49,129
the Exorcist okay now when we're talking

1757
01:21:56,529 --> 01:21:53,089
about some of those ritual stuff one of

1758
01:21:58,379 --> 01:21:56,539
the I mean there's so many different

1759
01:22:03,939 --> 01:21:58,389
examples in this book that cause your

1760
01:22:06,849 --> 01:22:03,949
imagination to wander and what the the

1761
01:22:13,089 --> 01:22:06,859
village in Germany how six thousand

1762
01:22:15,069 --> 01:22:13,099
years old right the yeah and that okay

1763
01:22:17,319 --> 01:22:15,079
this is I want to discuss this for a

1764
01:22:19,299 --> 01:22:17,329
second but I want to get to the end of

1765
01:22:21,359 --> 01:22:19,309
the village first and I want everybody

1766
01:22:24,849 --> 01:22:21,369
to understand what we're talking about

1767
01:22:26,770 --> 01:22:24,859
it appears that if my memories right

1768
01:22:31,869 --> 01:22:26,780
from reading the book that the village

1769
01:22:36,069 --> 01:22:31,879
was only there for fifty years right and

1770
01:22:39,250 --> 01:22:36,079
and that everybody around Europe as so

1771
01:22:43,869 --> 01:22:39,260
many thousands of years ago was going

1772
01:22:47,040 --> 01:22:43,879
there for some type of ritual and a lot

1773
01:22:50,049 --> 01:22:47,050
of crazy stuff went down in this village

1774
01:22:53,409 --> 01:22:50,059
when as an archaeologist when you start

1775
01:22:54,609 --> 01:22:53,419
to unearth these things the story starts

1776
01:22:59,379 --> 01:22:54,619
to tell itself

1777
01:23:00,189 --> 01:22:59,389
and you now reveal a pretty dark side to

1778
01:23:03,750 --> 01:23:00,199
this village

1779
01:23:07,569 --> 01:23:03,760
tell us about it yeah I mean this is

1780
01:23:09,189 --> 01:23:07,579
there's so many examples of this

1781
01:23:11,319 --> 01:23:09,199
happening

1782
01:23:13,330 --> 01:23:11,329
it's really quite weird I mean we get a

1783
01:23:15,279 --> 01:23:13,340
lot of times where we talk about haunted

1784
01:23:16,390 --> 01:23:15,289
places and I think I sort of cover that

1785
01:23:18,219 --> 01:23:16,400
in the book a little bit but a lot of

1786
01:23:21,879 --> 01:23:18,229
times we think of them as just haunted

1787
01:23:25,449 --> 01:23:21,889
houses or what have you but there's a

1788
01:23:27,399 --> 01:23:25,459
lot of strange places not just houses

1789
01:23:32,189 --> 01:23:27,409
and and so this would this would be an

1790
01:23:37,299 --> 01:23:32,199
example of how the oh did we lose you

1791
01:23:40,060 --> 01:23:37,309
did you hear that clunk okay Heather if

1792
01:23:45,310 --> 01:23:40,070
you can hear me I heard your microphone

1793
01:23:50,259 --> 01:23:45,320
go clunk that was see I knew it you

1794
01:23:52,839 --> 01:23:50,269
start talking about the CIA and it

1795
01:23:55,000 --> 01:23:52,849
happened at the break here so let me see

1796
01:23:58,120 --> 01:23:55,010
if I can get Heather back right before

1797
01:24:00,879 --> 01:23:58,130
the break but ya heard it go clunk

1798
01:24:05,830 --> 01:24:00,889
something happened I thought it was me

1799
01:24:10,509 --> 01:24:05,840
but I wasn't moving okay all right let's

1800
01:24:13,899 --> 01:24:10,519
see here hold on no nope she is not

1801
01:24:14,969 --> 01:24:13,909
there that is absolutely bizarre you

1802
01:24:19,750 --> 01:24:14,979
heard it didn't you

1803
01:24:20,969 --> 01:24:19,760
clunk that sounded like something

1804
01:24:26,759 --> 01:24:20,979
[Music]

1805
01:24:30,270 --> 01:24:26,769
something sinister went down her studio

1806
01:24:34,509 --> 01:24:30,280
okay I'll try it okay what happened huh

1807
01:24:39,449 --> 01:24:34,519
what happened I don't know about a

1808
01:24:41,649 --> 01:24:39,459
Neolithic Massacre it sounded it sounded

1809
01:24:45,939 --> 01:24:41,659
poltergeist ish it sounded like

1810
01:24:53,049 --> 01:24:45,949
something fell over Wow it was nice and

1811
01:24:54,939 --> 01:24:53,059
calm here I know I heard a kerplunk yeah

1812
01:24:57,729 --> 01:24:54,949
somebody just said that spooky I'm

1813
01:25:00,279 --> 01:24:57,739
watching everybody of course you know I

1814
01:25:05,199 --> 01:25:00,289
love you talk about the scary stuff that

1815
01:25:07,239 --> 01:25:05,209
happens on live radio okay we're going

1816
01:25:09,089 --> 01:25:07,249
to be going into a break here but so

1817
01:25:13,239 --> 01:25:09,099
we'll set this up for when we come back

1818
01:25:15,149 --> 01:25:13,249
and that is the what got unraveled at

1819
01:25:18,669 --> 01:25:15,159
the what was the name of the village

1820
01:25:22,400 --> 01:25:18,679
it was Herc's I'm Germany Kurt I'm

1821
01:25:26,990 --> 01:25:22,410
Germany as they start to unearth this

1822
01:25:29,000 --> 01:25:27,000
it was like one of the darkest stories

1823
01:25:31,280 --> 01:25:29,010
that you could ever imagine that was

1824
01:25:34,070 --> 01:25:31,290
unfolding for an archaeologist or am

1825
01:25:38,090 --> 01:25:34,080
anthropologist right I think it's

1826
01:25:40,130 --> 01:25:38,100
probably up there yeah well see okay all

1827
01:25:43,540 --> 01:25:40,140
right we're going to talk about this

1828
01:25:47,810 --> 01:25:43,550
when we come back but there was one

1829
01:25:52,430 --> 01:25:47,820
point to this story where I went you and

1830
01:25:56,300 --> 01:25:52,440
that was the vertebra right and now when

1831
01:26:00,110 --> 01:25:56,310
we are vertebra to me it just looks

1832
01:26:04,670 --> 01:26:00,120
scary right there's something you know

1833
01:26:05,930 --> 01:26:04,680
the and and what was dug up out of the

1834
01:26:09,800 --> 01:26:05,940
ground there when it came to the

1835
01:26:12,740 --> 01:26:09,810
vertebra now we have to figure out what

1836
01:26:14,660 --> 01:26:12,750
actually is going on and now I know the

1837
01:26:17,150 --> 01:26:14,670
audience is tripping right now Heather

1838
01:26:19,610 --> 01:26:17,160
we're going to tell you everything when

1839
01:26:21,440 --> 01:26:19,620
we come back after this short break stay

1840
01:26:23,540 --> 01:26:21,450
with this this is fade to black I'm your

1841
01:26:25,310 --> 01:26:23,550
host Jimmy Church our guest tonight dr.

1842
01:26:27,890 --> 01:26:25,320
Heather land and we're talking about her

1843
01:26:29,430 --> 01:26:27,900
book evil archaeology we'll be right

1844
01:26:41,400 --> 01:26:29,440
back after this short break stay with us

1845
01:26:41,410 --> 01:26:51,229
[Music]

1846
01:26:57,470 --> 01:26:54,439
way out here we listen to Jimmy Church

1847
01:26:59,970 --> 01:26:57,480
you're listening to faint and black

1848
01:27:02,820 --> 01:26:59,980
always on the edge of the hottest

1849
01:27:03,270 --> 01:27:02,830
alternative talk jimmy church with fade

1850
01:27:22,860 --> 01:27:03,280
to black

1851
01:27:26,580 --> 01:27:22,870
stay GRA radio.com hurricanes

1852
01:27:28,320 --> 01:27:26,590
earthquakes wildfires this year we've

1853
01:27:30,720 --> 01:27:28,330
experienced more than our fair share

1854
01:27:33,600 --> 01:27:30,730
this is Jimmy Church of fade to black

1855
01:27:35,820 --> 01:27:33,610
and last month I decided to make sure my

1856
01:27:37,950 --> 01:27:35,830
family does not have to worry about food

1857
01:27:41,700 --> 01:27:37,960
should we get caught in a real emergency

1858
01:27:43,590 --> 01:27:41,710
situation introducing Humana a healthy

1859
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storable product that tastes so good

1860
01:27:47,189 --> 01:27:45,219
that you'll want to eat it every day

1861
01:27:49,950 --> 01:27:47,199
instead of just during those times of

1862
01:27:53,340 --> 01:27:49,960
duress all new manna products have a 25

1863
01:27:55,459 --> 01:27:53,350
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1864
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1865
01:27:59,939 --> 01:27:57,910
with the new manna pack in your home

1866
01:28:02,490 --> 01:27:59,949
you'll be able to sleep at night knowing

1867
01:28:05,670 --> 01:28:02,500
that you protected your family not only

1868
01:28:08,040 --> 01:28:05,680
have I tasted and tested I own it now

1869
01:28:10,350 --> 01:28:08,050
you can too just click on the new manna

1870
01:28:12,420 --> 01:28:10,360
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1871
01:28:14,820 --> 01:28:12,430
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1872
01:28:16,950 --> 01:28:14,830
addition to a discount we'll send you an

1873
01:28:21,060 --> 01:28:16,960
autograph fade to black t-shirt

1874
01:28:23,939 --> 01:28:21,070
seriously gobekli tepe do you want to be

1875
01:28:25,890 --> 01:28:23,949
an official fade or not of course you do

1876
01:28:28,470 --> 01:28:25,900
this is Jimmy Church of fade to black

1877
01:28:31,320 --> 01:28:28,480
just go to our membership section at

1878
01:28:32,560 --> 01:28:31,330
Jimmy Church radio.com

1879
01:28:35,350 --> 01:28:32,570
[Music]

1880
01:28:38,150 --> 01:28:35,360
introducing the new surfer music app

1881
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or Google Play

1900
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just search surfer music or click on the

1901
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surfer Banner at Jimmy Church radio.com

1902
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1911
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1912
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1913
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Google Play or the iTunes App Store you

1914
01:30:13,390 --> 01:30:05,690
listen to us and we listen to you and so

1915
01:30:14,980 --> 01:30:13,400
does the CI k GRA radio.com if you have

1916
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hard water the lime scale not only

1917
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leaves white spots at clogs pipes and

1918
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1919
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1920
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1930
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1931
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1932
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1933
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1934
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1935
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1936
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1937
01:31:05,470 --> 01:31:03,950
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1938
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1939
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now the paranormal radio app free in

1940
01:31:15,460 --> 01:31:14,000
Google Play and the iOS App Store you

1941
01:31:17,740 --> 01:31:15,470
are listening to fade to black

1942
01:31:20,620 --> 01:31:17,750
with Jimmy Church on the game changer

1943
01:31:26,220 --> 01:31:23,440
hi I'm Lisa Vance you're listening to me

1944
01:31:29,800 --> 01:31:26,230
church this is revolution the revolution

1945
01:31:36,790 --> 01:31:29,810
will not be televised the revolution is

1946
01:32:15,790 --> 01:32:11,400
[Music]

1947
01:32:22,400 --> 01:32:17,840
welcome back fade to black coming off

1948
01:32:23,660 --> 01:32:22,410
Jimmy Church Heather and I are texting

1949
01:32:35,540 --> 01:32:23,670
during the break I'm gonna keep it

1950
01:32:37,220 --> 01:32:35,550
private but Heather you love Twitter you

1951
01:32:39,470 --> 01:32:37,230
know since we're talking about evil

1952
01:32:42,770 --> 01:32:39,480
archeology I got the evil laugh right

1953
01:32:46,100 --> 01:32:42,780
there and and you left Twitter and see

1954
01:32:48,770 --> 01:32:46,110
this is the thing I wish you would have

1955
01:32:51,440 --> 01:32:48,780
left Twitter but when you are out there

1956
01:32:54,710 --> 01:32:51,450
pushing like you are right you are

1957
01:32:56,360 --> 01:32:54,720
pushing it you you know you're doing the

1958
01:32:59,060 --> 01:32:56,370
right thing if you have somebody come at

1959
01:33:02,030 --> 01:32:59,070
you and you know you probably shouldn't

1960
01:33:07,330 --> 01:33:02,040
have left but but well you know you're

1961
01:33:10,310 --> 01:33:07,340
right I yeah maybe maybe not I probably

1962
01:33:13,130 --> 01:33:10,320
looked like I let them win I fight if I

1963
01:33:15,980 --> 01:33:13,140
left that way so yeah yeah it was a it

1964
01:33:18,350 --> 01:33:15,990
was a it was a very dramatic situation

1965
01:33:19,310 --> 01:33:18,360
yeah I know I know I know it just tells

1966
01:33:23,120 --> 01:33:19,320
you that you're doing the right thing

1967
01:33:26,060 --> 01:33:23,130
and it wasn't really about archaeology

1968
01:33:32,450 --> 01:33:26,070
at all was it was about a crazy person

1969
01:33:34,370 --> 01:33:32,460
create a crazy crazy person okay thought

1970
01:33:35,390 --> 01:33:34,380
about posting about it on my blog and I

1971
01:33:37,250 --> 01:33:35,400
thought hey you know I'm just gonna

1972
01:33:38,840 --> 01:33:37,260
leave it be and just not put the

1973
01:33:40,370 --> 01:33:38,850
negativity out there and just you know

1974
01:33:41,540 --> 01:33:40,380
maybe just get off Twitter but maybe

1975
01:33:44,660 --> 01:33:41,550
I'll get back on Twitter

1976
01:33:48,200 --> 01:33:44,670
maybe I'll just maybe I will yeah yeah

1977
01:33:51,260 --> 01:33:48,210
you should look just block that's all

1978
01:33:55,790 --> 01:33:51,270
you got to just block and and then and

1979
01:34:01,670 --> 01:33:55,800
they eventually go away now this this

1980
01:34:03,110 --> 01:34:01,680
village her time when when you are out

1981
01:34:05,690 --> 01:34:03,120
there I'm talking about yourself

1982
01:34:10,010 --> 01:34:05,700
specifically you know you're out doing a

1983
01:34:12,440 --> 01:34:10,020
dig and you start to see the picture

1984
01:34:15,740 --> 01:34:12,450
getting painted right and in the

1985
01:34:19,220 --> 01:34:15,750
situation with her time which turned out

1986
01:34:21,580 --> 01:34:19,230
to be one of the because this is the

1987
01:34:24,230 --> 01:34:21,590
Neolithic period this is a long time ago

1988
01:34:26,360 --> 01:34:24,240
where you wouldn't think that this type

1989
01:34:29,540 --> 01:34:26,370
of organization

1990
01:34:31,780 --> 01:34:29,550
organization of the the rituals

1991
01:34:34,130 --> 01:34:31,790
apparently that we're going down there

1992
01:34:36,230 --> 01:34:34,140
wouldn't be happening but they clearly

1993
01:34:41,000 --> 01:34:36,240
were and you start to see the story

1994
01:34:44,030 --> 01:34:41,010
unfold and the story of her time is

1995
01:34:46,250 --> 01:34:44,040
about as crazy as it gets and we we you

1996
01:34:48,920 --> 01:34:46,260
know we just don't think that things

1997
01:34:51,620 --> 01:34:48,930
like this went on in the past yeah I

1998
01:34:53,450 --> 01:34:51,630
mean that's some people call it the

1999
01:34:56,000 --> 01:34:53,460
noble savage you know that's like an old

2000
01:34:58,700 --> 01:34:56,010
idea and anthropology that you know when

2001
01:35:01,100 --> 01:34:58,710
you have villages or maybe just long

2002
01:35:03,620 --> 01:35:01,110
time ago Neolithic people that they were

2003
01:35:06,350 --> 01:35:03,630
maybe more peaceful or you know you have

2004
01:35:08,420 --> 01:35:06,360
ideas sometimes that they were living in

2005
01:35:10,940 --> 01:35:08,430
nature and sometimes we have a tendency

2006
01:35:13,880 --> 01:35:10,950
to romanticize it and then when you come

2007
01:35:16,130 --> 01:35:13,890
across sort of these sites and it's like

2008
01:35:18,020 --> 01:35:16,140
wake up call it wasn't they weren't all

2009
01:35:20,000 --> 01:35:18,030
that nice after all maybe but in this

2010
01:35:21,980 --> 01:35:20,010
town in Germany there was a team of

2011
01:35:24,050 --> 01:35:21,990
European archaeologists that you know

2012
01:35:27,640 --> 01:35:24,060
started excavating a massive bone pit

2013
01:35:29,720 --> 01:35:27,650
and you know I mean it could have been a

2014
01:35:32,060 --> 01:35:29,730
accident I mean it's not really unusual

2015
01:35:34,340 --> 01:35:32,070
to find a lot of bones in one location

2016
01:35:36,610 --> 01:35:34,350
but what they started to find was that

2017
01:35:41,770 --> 01:35:36,620
there were it was it was clear evidence

2018
01:35:44,180 --> 01:35:41,780
that these bones had been well

2019
01:35:47,870 --> 01:35:44,190
cannibalized they were people had been

2020
01:35:49,970 --> 01:35:47,880
eaten so they you could tell right away

2021
01:35:51,770 --> 01:35:49,980
and it from the scratches and the scrape

2022
01:35:54,290 --> 01:35:51,780
marks that they were consistent with

2023
01:35:56,330 --> 01:35:54,300
meat removal and in addition to that and

2024
01:35:57,500 --> 01:35:56,340
some people can also you know argue in

2025
01:35:59,570 --> 01:35:57,510
which they have saying well know that

2026
01:36:01,790 --> 01:35:59,580
you know those were just coincident that

2027
01:36:03,080 --> 01:36:01,800
although I mean it's very clear aside

2028
01:36:05,900 --> 01:36:03,090
from that if that weren't enough some of

2029
01:36:08,450 --> 01:36:05,910
the bones were charred and so you know

2030
01:36:10,790 --> 01:36:08,460
they had vertebrae as you mentioned and

2031
01:36:14,390 --> 01:36:10,800
long bones fractured so that the

2032
01:36:16,880 --> 01:36:14,400
prehistoric human fingers probed inside

2033
01:36:18,650 --> 01:36:16,890
to extract the marrow you could you

2034
01:36:21,260 --> 01:36:18,660
could just tell that these prehistoric

2035
01:36:24,080 --> 01:36:21,270
people were they were feasting and this

2036
01:36:28,120 --> 01:36:24,090
was this was a big bone pit of human

2037
01:36:31,370 --> 01:36:28,130
remains and so this was no accident and

2038
01:36:34,460 --> 01:36:31,380
you know it was pretty clear but the

2039
01:36:37,190 --> 01:36:34,470
mass grave I mean this was like 7,000

2040
01:36:39,260 --> 01:36:37,200
years ago in Germany and that desert

2041
01:36:41,780 --> 01:36:39,270
that's the that's the definition of

2042
01:36:46,880 --> 01:36:41,790
evil ARCA archeology right there that's

2043
01:36:50,090 --> 01:36:46,890
not spooky archeology because now you

2044
01:36:54,110 --> 01:36:50,100
are forced as an archaeologist and

2045
01:36:56,090 --> 01:36:54,120
you're sitting there having to put the

2046
01:36:58,130 --> 01:36:56,100
history together what's going through

2047
01:37:01,670 --> 01:36:58,140
your mind well the same thing that went

2048
01:37:04,070 --> 01:37:01,680
through my mind which is the the members

2049
01:37:06,620 --> 01:37:04,080
of this village sitting around poking

2050
01:37:09,860 --> 01:37:06,630
their fingers through vertebrae and

2051
01:37:13,840 --> 01:37:09,870
getting the marrow out around a campfire

2052
01:37:16,190 --> 01:37:13,850
and chicken wings or something right oh

2053
01:37:20,620 --> 01:37:16,200
I'm gonna be dubs and getting some

2054
01:37:28,940 --> 01:37:20,630
vertebrae right yes yes that's exactly

2055
01:37:32,240 --> 01:37:28,950
that's exactly what was going on no too

2056
01:37:34,010 --> 01:37:32,250
soon no but the yeah I mean this was

2057
01:37:36,170 --> 01:37:34,020
something that you could now if you were

2058
01:37:38,870 --> 01:37:36,180
to find this you could start to think of

2059
01:37:41,570 --> 01:37:38,880
a number of different hypotheses so you

2060
01:37:44,120 --> 01:37:41,580
could say well they were starving I mean

2061
01:37:46,280 --> 01:37:44,130
obviously the Donner Party and I mean

2062
01:37:48,410 --> 01:37:46,290
this happens even now where people are

2063
01:37:50,150 --> 01:37:48,420
in a very stressful situation and they

2064
01:37:52,160 --> 01:37:50,160
they have to do what they have to do to

2065
01:37:55,250 --> 01:37:52,170
survive and perhaps it was due to

2066
01:37:57,350 --> 01:37:55,260
survival but in this particular case it

2067
01:37:59,660 --> 01:37:57,360
actually appeared that the Neolithic

2068
01:38:03,020 --> 01:37:59,670
farmers in Central Europe I mean these

2069
01:38:05,780 --> 01:38:03,030
were farmers these Neolithic era that

2070
01:38:09,080 --> 01:38:05,790
they were engaging in regular acts of

2071
01:38:11,540 --> 01:38:09,090
cannibalism in a systematic way and so

2072
01:38:14,210 --> 01:38:11,550
what you see is at least I mean oh and

2073
01:38:15,680 --> 01:38:14,220
when I say bone pit I'm it might seem

2074
01:38:17,630 --> 01:38:15,690
like well you know maybe a good good

2075
01:38:19,580 --> 01:38:17,640
amount of bones there you know but just

2076
01:38:21,890 --> 01:38:19,590
to give you an idea of how many bones it

2077
01:38:27,080 --> 01:38:21,900
would it would be the bones butchered

2078
01:38:30,230 --> 01:38:27,090
bones of at least 500 people and this is

2079
01:38:35,290 --> 01:38:30,240
this is the closer for this is that

2080
01:38:38,420 --> 01:38:35,300
going through the DNA of these

2081
01:38:40,700 --> 01:38:38,430
cannibalized bones cooked bones they

2082
01:38:44,570 --> 01:38:40,710
came from all over Europe they weren't

2083
01:38:48,020 --> 01:38:44,580
just from Germany which says to me and

2084
01:38:51,410 --> 01:38:48,030
and to the historians that people were

2085
01:38:52,689 --> 01:38:51,420
traveling to this village for these

2086
01:38:54,729 --> 01:38:52,699
rituals

2087
01:39:02,890 --> 01:38:54,739
yeah some of them as far away as as

2088
01:39:05,620 --> 01:39:02,900
northwest France then it all stopped the

2089
01:39:09,070 --> 01:39:05,630
village was only around for about 50

2090
01:39:12,100 --> 01:39:09,080
years yeah yeah I mean and it's it's

2091
01:39:13,810 --> 01:39:12,110
just really amazing because some people

2092
01:39:15,880 --> 01:39:13,820
have said well maybe these were sick

2093
01:39:17,560 --> 01:39:15,890
people or maybe they weren't maybe maybe

2094
01:39:19,900 --> 01:39:17,570
this was stuff that happened after they

2095
01:39:21,070 --> 01:39:19,910
had died and I don't know why but you

2096
01:39:22,870 --> 01:39:21,080
know there's a lot of people trying to

2097
01:39:25,660 --> 01:39:22,880
make excuses for this horrific fine but

2098
01:39:27,790 --> 01:39:25,670
none of the bones showed any signs of

2099
01:39:30,580 --> 01:39:27,800
malnutrition or poor health or injury or

2100
01:39:34,540 --> 01:39:30,590
or anything like that and in fact some

2101
01:39:39,550 --> 01:39:34,550
of the bones were from babies and unborn

2102
01:39:41,439 --> 01:39:39,560
fetuses and old women women meant

2103
01:39:46,320 --> 01:39:41,449
everybody if they didn't discriminate it

2104
01:39:48,610 --> 01:39:46,330
was just let's see them all so it they

2105
01:39:51,550 --> 01:39:48,620
specifically though you can tell from

2106
01:39:54,340 --> 01:39:51,560
the marks on the bones that you know in

2107
01:39:59,320 --> 01:39:54,350
addition to being carved and charred

2108
01:40:00,820 --> 01:39:59,330
they had been put on skewers so I mean

2109
01:40:03,040 --> 01:40:00,830
they were making a real thing of this

2110
01:40:05,110 --> 01:40:03,050
this was you know as some people may say

2111
01:40:07,090 --> 01:40:05,120
this was a religious thing maybe they

2112
01:40:10,240 --> 01:40:07,100
were walking this this you know many

2113
01:40:13,030 --> 01:40:10,250
hundreds of miles to get to this this

2114
01:40:14,560 --> 01:40:13,040
village to do this but we really have no

2115
01:40:19,150 --> 01:40:14,570
way of knowing but all we do know is

2116
01:40:23,380 --> 01:40:19,160
that this was a very gruesome find now

2117
01:40:24,700 --> 01:40:23,390
when we talk about sinister relics you

2118
01:40:26,919 --> 01:40:24,710
know I brought up the omen and The

2119
01:40:29,169 --> 01:40:26,929
Exorcist earlier and I was trying

2120
01:40:33,130 --> 01:40:29,179
somebody posted the name of the daggers

2121
01:40:34,959 --> 01:40:33,140
that were unearthed at in the omen I

2122
01:40:40,750 --> 01:40:34,969
don't know how to say it is it

2123
01:40:43,919 --> 01:40:40,760
Megiddo nagito yes okay is is is this

2124
01:40:47,110 --> 01:40:43,929
something that happens often where an

2125
01:40:52,229 --> 01:40:47,120
archaeological dig and and relics of

2126
01:40:55,209 --> 01:40:52,239
this kind are actually unearthed well I

2127
01:40:58,419 --> 01:40:55,219
don't know that it's that common I

2128
01:41:00,490 --> 01:40:58,429
wouldn't say that it's common I mean but

2129
01:41:02,919 --> 01:41:00,500
then again we don't really know what

2130
01:41:04,780 --> 01:41:02,929
they dig up now do we they're not very

2131
01:41:07,930 --> 01:41:04,790
transparent about those things and and

2132
01:41:11,740 --> 01:41:07,940
so how do we know really what would be a

2133
01:41:13,930 --> 01:41:11,750
sinister relic unless we understood

2134
01:41:15,939 --> 01:41:13,940
completely that oh this is a maybe a

2135
01:41:19,090 --> 01:41:15,949
Pazuzu statuette or something to that

2136
01:41:20,439 --> 01:41:19,100
effect but unless you know what you're

2137
01:41:22,270 --> 01:41:20,449
looking for unless you're specifically

2138
01:41:25,030 --> 01:41:22,280
out there commissioning these digs

2139
01:41:27,430 --> 01:41:25,040
looking for particular items that you

2140
01:41:30,939 --> 01:41:27,440
think have a cult value which you know

2141
01:41:33,450 --> 01:41:30,949
has been done what so what is the

2142
01:41:35,919 --> 01:41:33,460
definition of a sinister relic Oh

2143
01:41:39,070 --> 01:41:35,929
something sinister would be just

2144
01:41:41,169 --> 01:41:39,080
foreboding or something that maybe would

2145
01:41:42,790 --> 01:41:41,179
scare the archaeologists or scare a

2146
01:41:44,740 --> 01:41:42,800
person who looked at it something that

2147
01:41:46,900 --> 01:41:44,750
would be so frightening that maybe they

2148
01:41:50,080 --> 01:41:46,910
felt they had to Ribery it which was

2149
01:41:53,130 --> 01:41:50,090
actually the case you know with one

2150
01:41:56,410 --> 01:41:53,140
Aztec artifact in particular it was a

2151
01:41:59,709 --> 01:41:56,420
just a goddess statue that it was quite

2152
01:42:01,630 --> 01:41:59,719
large and about nine feet that was just

2153
01:42:03,430 --> 01:42:01,640
so frightening to the archaeologists

2154
01:42:05,080 --> 01:42:03,440
they felt they needed to just go ahead

2155
01:42:07,150 --> 01:42:05,090
and ribéry it and never look at it again

2156
01:42:08,979 --> 01:42:07,160
which is actually a good fate for it

2157
01:42:10,979 --> 01:42:08,989
because they ended up being able to

2158
01:42:14,620 --> 01:42:10,989
excavate it again and now it's in the

2159
01:42:16,930 --> 01:42:14,630
museum in Mexico City whereas other

2160
01:42:19,120 --> 01:42:16,940
examples of archaeologists being a

2161
01:42:20,229 --> 01:42:19,130
little too scared to excavate something

2162
01:42:22,630 --> 01:42:20,239
or to bring it back they would just

2163
01:42:24,070 --> 01:42:22,640
simply destroy it and so then we have

2164
01:42:28,570 --> 01:42:24,080
some lost history there out of people

2165
01:42:30,100 --> 01:42:28,580
being afraid but you know that's what

2166
01:42:33,430 --> 01:42:30,110
happened a lot especially when you have

2167
01:42:36,189 --> 01:42:33,440
a Christian sort of you know coming into

2168
01:42:37,720 --> 01:42:36,199
the new world the situation where they

2169
01:42:39,310 --> 01:42:37,730
brought their Christian ideas of what

2170
01:42:41,800 --> 01:42:39,320
demons were and they saw these pagan

2171
01:42:43,600 --> 01:42:41,810
gods and and they said well these things

2172
01:42:45,760 --> 01:42:43,610
are definitely demons and so they

2173
01:42:48,760 --> 01:42:45,770
demonize these pagan Dee

2174
01:42:49,540 --> 01:42:48,770
and would sometimes destroy them or

2175
01:42:52,330 --> 01:42:49,550
deface the

2176
01:42:55,060 --> 01:42:52,340
art you know thinking they were doing

2177
01:42:56,800 --> 01:42:55,070
something holy or you know so but I

2178
01:43:00,970 --> 01:42:56,810
think that was definitely based in fear

2179
01:43:03,250 --> 01:43:00,980
as well and then we have I actually want

2180
01:43:11,080 --> 01:43:03,260
to stay right here for a second because

2181
01:43:13,380 --> 01:43:11,090
when you have evidence of how do I want

2182
01:43:17,740 --> 01:43:13,390
to say this where the the body

2183
01:43:20,740 --> 01:43:17,750
specifically was buried because of bad

2184
01:43:21,070 --> 01:43:20,750
things whether it was facing the wrong

2185
01:43:24,130 --> 01:43:21,080
way

2186
01:43:27,790 --> 01:43:24,140
it was decapitated arms are cut off you

2187
01:43:30,640 --> 01:43:27,800
know a buried with a child and there is

2188
01:43:34,060 --> 01:43:30,650
there was a reason for doing that and as

2189
01:43:36,130 --> 01:43:34,070
an archaeologist when you see that how

2190
01:43:41,310 --> 01:43:36,140
do you react to it and how do you figure

2191
01:43:44,020 --> 01:43:41,320
out why this happened to this individual

2192
01:43:47,290 --> 01:43:44,030
well there's a there's a lot of

2193
01:43:48,550 --> 01:43:47,300
pre-existing sort of explanations for

2194
01:43:51,730 --> 01:43:48,560
that in the literature so if you would

2195
01:43:53,170 --> 01:43:51,740
find something like you know well in

2196
01:43:55,470 --> 01:43:53,180
some of it not but some of the more

2197
01:43:58,120 --> 01:43:55,480
basic ones would be like the vampire

2198
01:44:00,730 --> 01:43:58,130
burials something where you know you'll

2199
01:44:02,680 --> 01:44:00,740
find a brick or something put into the

2200
01:44:04,510 --> 01:44:02,690
mouth or something needs a stake through

2201
01:44:06,660 --> 01:44:04,520
the heart those sorts of things those

2202
01:44:09,520 --> 01:44:06,670
would be clear indicators that the

2203
01:44:12,100 --> 01:44:09,530
person who was buried there they didn't

2204
01:44:13,690 --> 01:44:12,110
want them to come back you know so this

2205
01:44:16,570 --> 01:44:13,700
so there's that but then you sometimes

2206
01:44:18,100 --> 01:44:16,580
you get yeah well then you have the

2207
01:44:22,210 --> 01:44:18,110
historical record you have to think of

2208
01:44:24,760 --> 01:44:22,220
like the case with the severed hands in

2209
01:44:26,980 --> 01:44:24,770
Egypt they found a pit of severed right

2210
01:44:29,110 --> 01:44:26,990
hands that's all it was just severed

2211
01:44:31,840 --> 01:44:29,120
right hands not left there were no feet

2212
01:44:33,460 --> 01:44:31,850
it was nothing like that and so it first

2213
01:44:34,690 --> 01:44:33,470
it with that you would think well what

2214
01:44:36,670 --> 01:44:34,700
is this you know and of course you're

2215
01:44:39,340 --> 01:44:36,680
gonna say ritual because that's you know

2216
01:44:41,980 --> 01:44:39,350
it would archaeologists often do but in

2217
01:44:45,520 --> 01:44:41,990
all seriousness it was you know because

2218
01:44:49,180 --> 01:44:45,530
of historical literature so say the

2219
01:44:51,370 --> 01:44:49,190
hieroglyphs biblical verses even who the

2220
01:44:53,590 --> 01:44:51,380
depicted warriors cutting off the hands

2221
01:44:57,070 --> 01:44:53,600
of their opponents that they you know

2222
01:44:59,350 --> 01:44:57,080
had defeated Egyptian lore describes the

2223
01:45:02,740 --> 01:44:59,360
practices proof of an enemies defeat

2224
01:45:05,440 --> 01:45:02,750
with a severed hand exchanged like it

2225
01:45:07,360 --> 01:45:05,450
would be for gold so it's a proof that

2226
01:45:08,320 --> 01:45:07,370
you killed the person and so you know

2227
01:45:09,760 --> 01:45:08,330
there's all these different things so

2228
01:45:13,000 --> 01:45:09,770
you'd have to sort of look at that and

2229
01:45:15,070 --> 01:45:13,010
in the context and then see if there was

2230
01:45:16,360 --> 01:45:15,080
any other data that you could get and so

2231
01:45:19,120 --> 01:45:16,370
you really have to take it as a

2232
01:45:22,320 --> 01:45:19,130
case-by-case basis and then there's some

2233
01:45:25,360 --> 01:45:22,330
and I just posted one on my facebook

2234
01:45:28,330 --> 01:45:25,370
like earlier today that was a new thing

2235
01:45:30,580 --> 01:45:28,340
that popped up that was quite creepy

2236
01:45:34,390 --> 01:45:30,590
actually they find these things called

2237
01:45:37,360 --> 01:45:34,400
coffin births it's where you find a

2238
01:45:39,400 --> 01:45:37,370
woman who you know clearly dead but then

2239
01:45:42,640 --> 01:45:39,410
you find that it looks as though she had

2240
01:45:44,770 --> 01:45:42,650
given birth after she was dead I said

2241
01:45:46,240 --> 01:45:44,780
they call it the you know coffin birth

2242
01:45:48,460 --> 01:45:46,250
so these women are giving birth even

2243
01:45:51,160 --> 01:45:48,470
after they're dead and so what you find

2244
01:46:00,580 --> 01:45:51,170
in that situation though is a is you

2245
01:46:06,250 --> 01:46:00,590
know hold on a minute here a minute what

2246
01:46:10,390 --> 01:46:06,260
are we talkin fetal extrusion also known

2247
01:46:14,650 --> 01:46:10,400
as coffin birth and in the ground in the

2248
01:46:16,180 --> 01:46:14,660
ground so what what it is though and of

2249
01:46:20,950 --> 01:46:16,190
course this would have scared ancient

2250
01:46:22,870 --> 01:46:20,960
people did to debt to death but now we

2251
01:46:24,310 --> 01:46:22,880
sort of have an idea now this is also

2252
01:46:27,250 --> 01:46:24,320
just a theory let me just put that out

2253
01:46:29,650 --> 01:46:27,260
there but the theory is that it's due to

2254
01:46:33,010 --> 01:46:29,660
a natural process of decomposition so

2255
01:46:34,930 --> 01:46:33,020
it's the pressure from gas during

2256
01:46:36,610 --> 01:46:34,940
composition that builds up in the womb

2257
01:46:38,260 --> 01:46:36,620
and I you know fair warning you know

2258
01:46:40,210 --> 01:46:38,270
this can get a little graphic but the

2259
01:46:41,980 --> 01:46:40,220
decomposition it builds up in the womb

2260
01:46:44,740 --> 01:46:41,990
and it will cause so much pressure that

2261
01:46:46,930 --> 01:46:44,750
it then just explodes and it blows a

2262
01:46:49,060 --> 01:46:46,940
hole right through the uterus and into

2263
01:46:51,850 --> 01:46:49,070
the vagina and it forces the fetus out

2264
01:46:53,830 --> 01:46:51,860
of the body and it results in what looks

2265
01:46:56,620 --> 01:46:53,840
to be that the corpse of a pregnant

2266
01:47:00,070 --> 01:46:56,630
woman gives birth after death and so you

2267
01:47:02,950 --> 01:47:00,080
see that no is there a possibility I've

2268
01:47:06,390 --> 01:47:02,960
got to ask the obvious question that the

2269
01:47:13,440 --> 01:47:10,230
I would say probably not because I mean

2270
01:47:15,900 --> 01:47:13,450
by the time the body would decompose to

2271
01:47:18,990 --> 01:47:15,910
the level that you know it had this gas

2272
01:47:20,700 --> 01:47:19,000
the nutrient and oxygen supply to the

2273
01:47:22,290 --> 01:47:20,710
baby would have been cut off if the

2274
01:47:23,790 --> 01:47:22,300
mothers dead and then you know there's

2275
01:47:26,970 --> 01:47:23,800
the placenta and the blood you know

2276
01:47:28,560 --> 01:47:26,980
flowing to give oxygen to the baby it

2277
01:47:31,320 --> 01:47:28,570
wouldn't have long before it would die

2278
01:47:34,710 --> 01:47:31,330
so I would say thankfully that by the

2279
01:47:36,120 --> 01:47:34,720
time the you know decomposing body gets

2280
01:47:39,060 --> 01:47:36,130
to that point where it's gonna just blow

2281
01:47:41,130 --> 01:47:39,070
the fetus out that the fetus was already

2282
01:47:43,350 --> 01:47:41,140
dead but in this particular recent case

2283
01:47:46,380 --> 01:47:43,360
in Italy the woman had also been treated

2284
01:47:48,810 --> 01:47:46,390
with trepanation the drilling the hole

2285
01:47:51,530 --> 01:47:48,820
in the head so that what they believe is

2286
01:47:53,340 --> 01:47:51,540
the she was suffering from sort of a

2287
01:47:55,620 --> 01:47:53,350
preeclampsia or some sort of

2288
01:47:57,240 --> 01:47:55,630
hypertensive disorder and so they maybe

2289
01:47:58,590 --> 01:47:57,250
were trying to help her by drilling the

2290
01:48:01,020 --> 01:47:58,600
hole in her head that didn't work and

2291
01:48:04,050 --> 01:48:01,030
she just ends up dying and then you know

2292
01:48:06,300 --> 01:48:04,060
blasts the baby out in the post-mortem

2293
01:48:09,000 --> 01:48:06,310
so yeah I mean that would be considered

2294
01:48:10,890 --> 01:48:09,010
another I guess a horrific

2295
01:48:12,240 --> 01:48:10,900
archaeological discovery but again if

2296
01:48:13,980 --> 01:48:12,250
you come across that it would look

2297
01:48:16,020 --> 01:48:13,990
really weird but if you sort of know

2298
01:48:18,840 --> 01:48:16,030
that there's such a thing as you know

2299
01:48:20,940 --> 01:48:18,850
post-mortem fetal extrusion then you

2300
01:48:22,890 --> 01:48:20,950
could say oh okay this looks to be one

2301
01:48:24,240 --> 01:48:22,900
of those cases and so each thing you

2302
01:48:26,490 --> 01:48:24,250
have to sort of take as a case-by-case

2303
01:48:28,830 --> 01:48:26,500
and then that's where osteo archeology

2304
01:48:30,840 --> 01:48:28,840
comes into play you really have to know

2305
01:48:33,840 --> 01:48:30,850
the bones and be able to look at it that

2306
01:48:37,380 --> 01:48:33,850
way but now it also reminds me a little

2307
01:48:41,970 --> 01:48:37,390
bit off subject but in in the past where

2308
01:48:45,120 --> 01:48:41,980
they would have a bell right above the

2309
01:48:47,610 --> 01:48:45,130
grave with the string going down into

2310
01:48:49,920 --> 01:48:47,620
the coffin just in case somebody wasn't

2311
01:48:52,950 --> 01:48:49,930
really dead dead they could ring the

2312
01:48:57,270 --> 01:48:52,960
bell hence the term dead ringer dead

2313
01:48:59,490 --> 01:48:57,280
ringer and then there what Andy and this

2314
01:49:02,640 --> 01:48:59,500
is another little little blurb in the

2315
01:49:06,030 --> 01:49:02,650
book that that also caught my eye about

2316
01:49:08,340 --> 01:49:06,040
having to go out and and check on people

2317
01:49:11,940 --> 01:49:08,350
that were buried to make sure that they

2318
01:49:15,060 --> 01:49:11,950
were still dead yeah because they they

2319
01:49:18,360 --> 01:49:15,070
didn't have you know a really good

2320
01:49:20,070 --> 01:49:18,370
corner and so you know you could be

2321
01:49:21,990 --> 01:49:20,080
maybe this past hour sometime

2322
01:49:24,180 --> 01:49:22,000
sadly really drunk you might have just

2323
01:49:26,820 --> 01:49:24,190
drank yourself into you know living in

2324
01:49:29,280 --> 01:49:26,830
and then uh I guess protocol Joe's just

2325
01:49:31,260 --> 01:49:29,290
down for the count and go through the

2326
01:49:33,150 --> 01:49:31,270
burial and everything and nope guess he

2327
01:49:35,730 --> 01:49:33,160
was alive after all happened more often

2328
01:49:40,230 --> 01:49:35,740
than than you'd think so yeah they would

2329
01:49:42,000 --> 01:49:40,240
do that yeah funny you know this is why

2330
01:49:45,420 --> 01:49:42,010
everybody should get the book I mean it

2331
01:49:49,950 --> 01:49:45,430
is full I had said to Heather earlier

2332
01:49:53,240 --> 01:49:49,960
today all I did was let my mind just

2333
01:49:56,490 --> 01:49:53,250
went I was painting all of these vivid

2334
01:49:58,710 --> 01:49:56,500
pictures in my mind as I'm reading the

2335
01:50:03,320 --> 01:49:58,720
book it was just so much fun to do in a

2336
01:50:07,040 --> 01:50:03,330
weird way and and it's great and so is

2337
01:50:11,400 --> 01:50:07,050
vampires what do you think of the

2338
01:50:14,520 --> 01:50:11,410
Mesopotamian toilet demon yes actually

2339
01:50:17,340 --> 01:50:14,530
actually tell us about the Mesopotamian

2340
01:50:20,100 --> 01:50:17,350
toilet demon well this is it's actually

2341
01:50:21,780 --> 01:50:20,110
a kind of a common thing you'll find as

2342
01:50:25,110 --> 01:50:21,790
strangely in the ancient texts is there

2343
01:50:27,720 --> 01:50:25,120
are these toilet demons and so there are

2344
01:50:29,940 --> 01:50:27,730
a lot of warnings about toilet behavior

2345
01:50:32,280 --> 01:50:29,950
and how to be safe and guard against the

2346
01:50:34,920 --> 01:50:32,290
dreaded toilet demon one of the warnings

2347
01:50:37,950 --> 01:50:34,930
is after coming from the toilet you you

2348
01:50:41,060 --> 01:50:37,960
should not have intercourse immediately

2349
01:50:44,160 --> 01:50:41,070
or else the children that you may have

2350
01:50:46,200 --> 01:50:44,170
after that intercourse will be epileptic

2351
01:50:47,940 --> 01:50:46,210
and so I mean this whole like mythos

2352
01:50:51,270 --> 01:50:47,950
surround that so there was a definitely

2353
01:50:53,310 --> 01:50:51,280
a sort of set of manners and etiquette

2354
01:50:55,550 --> 01:50:53,320
around the toilet and what you should do

2355
01:51:00,150 --> 01:50:55,560
to avoid this toilet demon and so

2356
01:51:01,950 --> 01:51:00,160
basically it it parallels the beliefs of

2357
01:51:05,490 --> 01:51:01,960
the Acadians you see this goes all the

2358
01:51:07,350 --> 01:51:05,500
way back to Sumer Babylon and even in

2359
01:51:09,690 --> 01:51:07,360
Hebrew and Jewish faith they kind of

2360
01:51:13,290 --> 01:51:09,700
carried this thing along with the this

2361
01:51:16,200 --> 01:51:13,300
demon was supposedly living in toilets

2362
01:51:18,750 --> 01:51:16,210
it looks sort of like a lion sometimes

2363
01:51:21,270 --> 01:51:18,760
it looks like a goat but it lives in

2364
01:51:23,040 --> 01:51:21,280
toilets and it causes epilepsy to either

2365
01:51:25,260 --> 01:51:23,050
the children of course if you do wrong

2366
01:51:26,820 --> 01:51:25,270
unhygenic things but it can also cause

2367
01:51:30,240 --> 01:51:26,830
the person going to the toilet to have

2368
01:51:31,890 --> 01:51:30,250
epilepsy strokes or sudden Falls and so

2369
01:51:33,350 --> 01:51:31,900
in in one case it's mentioned in a

2370
01:51:37,460 --> 01:51:33,360
medical handbook

2371
01:51:40,520 --> 01:51:37,470
that if somebody falls on their left

2372
01:51:42,470 --> 01:51:40,530
side during a seizure or stroke then

2373
01:51:44,690 --> 01:51:42,480
that's an indicator that they had been

2374
01:51:46,970 --> 01:51:44,700
struck down by the hand of the toilet

2375
01:51:51,650 --> 01:51:46,980
demon I was gonna read that passage

2376
01:51:54,200 --> 01:51:51,660
right now and yeah if if his right side

2377
01:51:57,260 --> 01:51:54,210
is let down stroke and flicked by a

2378
01:51:59,840 --> 01:51:57,270
lurker he will recover if the right side

2379
01:52:02,720 --> 01:51:59,850
of his body is in its entirety let down

2380
01:52:10,730 --> 01:52:02,730
the stroke inflicted by a lurker he has

2381
01:52:13,760 --> 01:52:10,740
been hit at the rear now this is the

2382
01:52:17,480 --> 01:52:13,770
crazy part about this is that the demon

2383
01:52:21,140 --> 01:52:17,490
finds it easy because you're alone at

2384
01:52:23,690 --> 01:52:21,150
your most vulnerable and I would say

2385
01:52:26,570 --> 01:52:23,700
that that is true right yes and that's

2386
01:52:28,370 --> 01:52:26,580
part of you're a lurker kind of

2387
01:52:29,120 --> 01:52:28,380
archetype demon that you'd find in the

2388
01:52:31,220 --> 01:52:29,130
ancient world

2389
01:52:32,630 --> 01:52:31,230
these lurkers would just they would not

2390
01:52:35,390 --> 01:52:32,640
just be at toilets but they would be in

2391
01:52:37,420 --> 01:52:35,400
dark areas abandoned places and this

2392
01:52:40,430 --> 01:52:37,430
sort of thing but this one is

2393
01:52:42,380 --> 01:52:40,440
specifically a works around the toilet

2394
01:52:44,270 --> 01:52:42,390
and so when you're alone yes and it

2395
01:52:46,550 --> 01:52:44,280
you're most vulnerable

2396
01:52:49,820 --> 01:52:46,560
you know beware of the toilet demon I

2397
01:52:53,540 --> 01:52:49,830
know okay I'm taking crystals into the

2398
01:52:55,580 --> 01:52:53,550
bathroom from now on so I want to and I

2399
01:52:58,940 --> 01:52:55,590
want to continue this after we come back

2400
01:53:03,770 --> 01:52:58,950
after the break but vampires now I have

2401
01:53:06,110 --> 01:53:03,780
I have read in I'm just going let's see

2402
01:53:08,600 --> 01:53:06,120
in the last two years where I have read

2403
01:53:13,010 --> 01:53:08,610
different news reports and press

2404
01:53:16,690 --> 01:53:13,020
releases of different archeological digs

2405
01:53:19,880 --> 01:53:16,700
around the world I have seen vampire in

2406
01:53:24,610 --> 01:53:19,890
more of these press releases than others

2407
01:53:28,760 --> 01:53:24,620
and so what would indicate and it does

2408
01:53:32,450 --> 01:53:28,770
this is dating back way before Dracula

2409
01:53:34,910 --> 01:53:32,460
and and the book you know Bram Stoker

2410
01:53:39,500 --> 01:53:34,920
this is predating all of that how far

2411
01:53:41,240 --> 01:53:39,510
back does vampirism go oh I mean it does

2412
01:53:44,420 --> 01:53:41,250
it goes it goes

2413
01:53:46,280 --> 01:53:44,430
as far back as the record really I mean

2414
01:53:49,280 --> 01:53:46,290
there's all sorts of accounts of this

2415
01:53:52,189 --> 01:53:49,290
this idea of a blood sucking and people

2416
01:53:53,780 --> 01:53:52,199
being afraid and so yeah I mean it's

2417
01:53:56,090 --> 01:53:53,790
it's another one of these things that

2418
01:53:58,760 --> 01:53:56,100
sort of travels with us just like demons

2419
01:54:01,729 --> 01:53:58,770
in general which is and all of these

2420
01:54:04,040 --> 01:54:01,739
spooky things that I guess are the

2421
01:54:06,170 --> 01:54:04,050
things that nightmares were made of and

2422
01:54:08,450 --> 01:54:06,180
that they still carry a significant sow

2423
01:54:10,400 --> 01:54:08,460
and vampires are constant through

2424
01:54:12,050 --> 01:54:10,410
history I would say and what is it that

2425
01:54:13,550 --> 01:54:12,060
you look for as an archaeologist when

2426
01:54:18,650 --> 01:54:13,560
you're doing a dig like this and you

2427
01:54:20,540 --> 01:54:18,660
find a skeleton of remains to to

2428
01:54:23,930 --> 01:54:20,550
indicate that this person was buried

2429
01:54:28,370 --> 01:54:23,940
because they were a vampire anything

2430
01:54:30,290 --> 01:54:28,380
really that would show that you didn't

2431
01:54:32,990 --> 01:54:30,300
want them to rise again from the dead

2432
01:54:35,570 --> 01:54:33,000
because that was something that was very

2433
01:54:38,420 --> 01:54:35,580
prominent in this idea that these these

2434
01:54:40,160 --> 01:54:38,430
vampires would would not die they they

2435
01:54:42,020 --> 01:54:40,170
would be able to appear dead or

2436
01:54:43,280 --> 01:54:42,030
what-have-you but then they could you

2437
01:54:45,110 --> 01:54:43,290
know rise again and so you'd want to

2438
01:54:47,810 --> 01:54:45,120
make sure that they couldn't do that so

2439
01:54:50,470 --> 01:54:47,820
any way that you could do that by either

2440
01:54:53,090 --> 01:54:50,480
having a stake through the heart

2441
01:54:54,950 --> 01:54:53,100
mutilated bones so that if they were to

2442
01:54:59,030 --> 01:54:54,960
sort of resurrect they wouldn't be able

2443
01:55:00,950 --> 01:54:59,040
to go anywhere or do anything a number

2444
01:55:05,420 --> 01:55:00,960
of different things so legs could be out

2445
01:55:08,150 --> 01:55:05,430
of place you know sometimes something

2446
01:55:11,780 --> 01:55:08,160
put into their mouth and and a lot of

2447
01:55:13,550 --> 01:55:11,790
that was also to sort of indicate that

2448
01:55:15,170 --> 01:55:13,560
yes this was a vampire in case maybe a

2449
01:55:16,850 --> 01:55:15,180
grave robber or somebody like that would

2450
01:55:19,610 --> 01:55:16,860
come across that they would say oh wait

2451
01:55:22,070 --> 01:55:19,620
no don't don't you know don't mess with

2452
01:55:23,780 --> 01:55:22,080
this this is a vampire grave because if

2453
01:55:24,260 --> 01:55:23,790
you basically if you didn't do these

2454
01:55:27,110 --> 01:55:24,270
things

2455
01:55:29,810 --> 01:55:27,120
the vampire could rise again so they

2456
01:55:32,240 --> 01:55:29,820
would even they could pin them down with

2457
01:55:34,160 --> 01:55:32,250
wings anything you could imagine really

2458
01:55:36,979 --> 01:55:34,170
the whole idea was just to keep them

2459
01:55:41,030 --> 01:55:36,989
down so they couldn't resurrect from the

2460
01:55:43,130 --> 01:55:41,040
grave and so they yeah it it's really

2461
01:55:44,930 --> 01:55:43,140
another I think that's one of the things

2462
01:55:48,050 --> 01:55:44,940
when I put in the book horrific

2463
01:55:49,610 --> 01:55:48,060
archaeological discoveries the idea

2464
01:55:51,290 --> 01:55:49,620
people say well what is horrific you

2465
01:55:55,180 --> 01:55:51,300
know what what is gruesome what what are

2466
01:55:58,240 --> 01:55:55,190
these things something to me would be

2467
01:55:59,890 --> 01:55:58,250
strange arrangement of human remains I

2468
01:56:02,350 --> 01:55:59,900
think there's something inherently

2469
01:56:05,110 --> 01:56:02,360
disturbing about that as a human right

2470
01:56:07,840 --> 01:56:05,120
when you look and you see bizarre and

2471
01:56:10,720 --> 01:56:07,850
disturbing burials that's just something

2472
01:56:13,540 --> 01:56:10,730
that it I think it reminds us of our own

2473
01:56:15,220 --> 01:56:13,550
mortality and there was the case of the

2474
01:56:18,520 --> 01:56:15,230
I talked about in the book of the

2475
01:56:20,680 --> 01:56:18,530
Capuchin crypt in Rome for just reasons

2476
01:56:23,110 --> 01:56:20,690
they don't even know the Capuchin monks

2477
01:56:24,790 --> 01:56:23,120
started to decorate five rooms of their

2478
01:56:29,350 --> 01:56:24,800
crypt beneath their little church with

2479
01:56:31,030 --> 01:56:29,360
bones of their dead brothers and it's

2480
01:56:32,140 --> 01:56:31,040
you know and it wasn't just their dead

2481
01:56:33,810 --> 01:56:32,150
brothers because they later found out

2482
01:56:37,090 --> 01:56:33,820
they were there were the bones of

2483
01:56:39,580 --> 01:56:37,100
orphaned village children as well but

2484
01:56:41,320 --> 01:56:39,590
the Crypt it has all of these different

2485
01:56:44,709 --> 01:56:41,330
bones and these decorative arrangements

2486
01:56:46,720 --> 01:56:44,719
of about 4,000 people so far that

2487
01:56:48,370 --> 01:56:46,730
they've counted that's a lot of pee

2488
01:56:51,400 --> 01:56:48,380
that's a small village that's you know

2489
01:56:53,950 --> 01:56:51,410
if that could be a little town of 4,000

2490
01:56:55,959 --> 01:56:53,960
people including the Friars and the

2491
01:56:58,000 --> 01:56:55,969
local orphans all put together so they

2492
01:57:00,490 --> 01:56:58,010
have all of these remains and they're

2493
01:57:03,240 --> 01:57:00,500
just in the most elaborate formations as

2494
01:57:05,830 --> 01:57:03,250
decorations so they have chandeliers

2495
01:57:08,500 --> 01:57:05,840
candelabras crosses they even have a

2496
01:57:11,200 --> 01:57:08,510
coat of arms and in a way it's it's

2497
01:57:12,820 --> 01:57:11,210
really astonishing and it's beautiful

2498
01:57:13,150 --> 01:57:12,830
until you really look and say wait a

2499
01:57:14,920 --> 01:57:13,160
minute

2500
01:57:17,110 --> 01:57:14,930
those are knuckle bones that those are

2501
01:57:18,490 --> 01:57:17,120
there like 20 femurs right there wait a

2502
01:57:20,500 --> 01:57:18,500
minute what am I looking at it's really

2503
01:57:23,590 --> 01:57:20,510
gruesome and at the entrance there's a

2504
01:57:27,790 --> 01:57:23,600
plaque that sort of reminds everybody it

2505
01:57:32,709 --> 01:57:27,800
says what you are now we once were what

2506
01:57:34,840 --> 01:57:32,719
we are now you shall be the the thought

2507
01:57:37,630 --> 01:57:34,850
of because you know the stake through

2508
01:57:40,060 --> 01:57:37,640
the heart right okay we get that we've

2509
01:57:45,820 --> 01:57:40,070
all seen the movies but when that is

2510
01:57:48,340 --> 01:57:45,830
found in a dig is the stake done after

2511
01:57:51,820 --> 01:57:48,350
the body is dead you know what I mean to

2512
01:57:55,870 --> 01:57:51,830
keep it from coming back alive I don't

2513
01:57:58,870 --> 01:57:55,880
know the yeah I mean I think that that

2514
01:58:01,330 --> 01:57:58,880
in some cases yes but in some cases no I

2515
01:58:03,520 --> 01:58:01,340
think that you if you were in a village

2516
01:58:05,409 --> 01:58:03,530
and you knew you had a vampire and you

2517
01:58:07,179 --> 01:58:05,419
blame them for all your woes and your

2518
01:58:08,919 --> 01:58:07,189
hardships I think that it wouldn't take

2519
01:58:10,439 --> 01:58:08,929
much for somebody to be motivated to

2520
01:58:13,689 --> 01:58:10,449
just do that while you're still alive

2521
01:58:18,219 --> 01:58:13,699
and and the thought of we've got to take

2522
01:58:21,189 --> 01:58:18,229
a break right here but recovering or

2523
01:58:23,889 --> 01:58:21,199
looking at a skeleton the remains and

2524
01:58:26,679 --> 01:58:23,899
having it chained to the ground right or

2525
01:58:29,080 --> 01:58:26,689
tied to the ground you're right I mean

2526
01:58:30,459 --> 01:58:29,090
as humans that's one of the most

2527
01:58:33,129 --> 01:58:30,469
frightening things that you could see

2528
01:58:36,790 --> 01:58:33,139
and you would even wonder if if they

2529
01:58:38,679 --> 01:58:36,800
were buried alive right yeah let's take

2530
01:58:40,689 --> 01:58:38,689
a break right here this is fade to black

2531
01:58:43,239 --> 01:58:40,699
I'm your host Jimmy church tonight our

2532
01:58:45,699 --> 01:58:43,249
guest is dr. Heather Lynn we're talking

2533
01:58:48,370 --> 01:58:45,709
about her book oh I've got the page open

2534
01:58:50,229 --> 01:58:48,380
right here the message a Miam toilet

2535
01:58:51,920 --> 01:58:50,239
demons right there it's called evil

2536
01:58:59,010 --> 01:58:51,930
archeology we'll be right back

2537
01:59:06,120 --> 01:59:01,450
everybody's out of the mental guard on

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this is kera digital broadcasting

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[Music]

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your contact for current news and

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trending topics je GRA radio.com does

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[Music]

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Solutions

2595
02:01:24,959 --> 02:01:22,949
this is Jimmy Church of fade to black

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02:01:28,080 --> 02:01:24,969
and I only drink

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fade to black blend coffee from River

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Moon just click on the River Moon coffee

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02:01:37,649 --> 02:01:33,550
banner at Jimmy Church radio.com promo

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being tired well then it's time to get

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about this all-natural all organic tea

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I've been drinking that has had great

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2606
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it's called life changed tea and it's

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specially formulated to help detoxify

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and cleanse your kidneys liver colon and

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blood all at once the colon is one of

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02:02:02,669 --> 02:01:59,919
the most ignored organs in the human

2611
02:02:04,469 --> 02:02:02,679
body the faster that waste is eliminated

2612
02:02:06,479 --> 02:02:04,479
from the body the less time that way

2613
02:02:08,429 --> 02:02:06,489
sits in our intestine spreading toxins

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02:02:10,350 --> 02:02:08,439
to our bloodstream this tea helps

2615
02:02:12,600 --> 02:02:10,360
cleanse chemicals caused by outside

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system and get this weight loss can be a

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side effect and with continued use of

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the tea you can experience clearer

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if you're tired of being tired

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get the life change tea at get the tea

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2625
02:02:36,810 --> 02:02:34,619
you'll be glad you did

2626
02:02:38,520 --> 02:02:36,820
did you know that when you're on the

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02:02:40,979 --> 02:02:38,530
road with limited data or Wi-Fi

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available you can still listen to every

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02:02:45,719 --> 02:02:42,909
minute of fade to black by just calling

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02:02:48,750 --> 02:02:45,729
six oh five five six two four four eight

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two no smartphone app or internet needed

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it saves your data plan and no extra

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eight two you can listen to me Jimmy

2636
02:03:08,370 --> 02:03:01,539
Church on any phone anytime anywhere

2637
02:03:12,400 --> 02:03:10,070
[Music]

2638
02:03:17,150 --> 02:03:12,410
[Applause]

2639
02:03:19,780 --> 02:03:17,160
you wanna know a secret I love ponies I

2640
02:03:22,400 --> 02:03:19,790
really love ponies I'm serious I

2641
02:03:26,300 --> 02:03:22,410
couldn't stay stable without poor mr.

2642
02:03:31,829 --> 02:03:26,310
Brooks why fade to black because you

2643
02:03:37,290 --> 02:03:34,259
this is fade to black with Jimmy Church

2644
02:03:41,600 --> 02:03:37,300
on the game changer radio network and K

2645
02:03:55,070 --> 02:03:41,610
GRA the global radio alliance

2646
02:04:00,840 --> 02:03:57,390
welcome back fade to black come here to

2647
02:04:02,610 --> 02:04:00,850
me Church I guess tonight is dr. Heather

2648
02:04:07,520 --> 02:04:02,620
Lynn and of course we are talking about

2649
02:04:10,140 --> 02:04:07,530
her book evil archeology and in the book

2650
02:04:13,709 --> 02:04:10,150
there are literally hundreds and

2651
02:04:15,540 --> 02:04:13,719
hundreds of references and different

2652
02:04:17,850 --> 02:04:15,550
digs and things that have happened

2653
02:04:20,310 --> 02:04:17,860
throughout history and it is really

2654
02:04:26,550 --> 02:04:20,320
well-written and very comprehensive but

2655
02:04:28,770 --> 02:04:26,560
there is one case Heather that I want to

2656
02:04:33,510 --> 02:04:28,780
talk about now that's the frozen Inca

2657
02:04:34,439 --> 02:04:33,520
mummies and this is one I'm a parent

2658
02:04:47,760 --> 02:04:34,449
okay

2659
02:04:51,930 --> 02:04:47,770
and reading about what was uncovered is

2660
02:04:54,439 --> 02:04:51,940
is just chilling and it's it's a it's a

2661
02:04:56,669 --> 02:04:54,449
it's a it's a hair-raising

2662
02:05:00,120 --> 02:04:56,679
archaeological find and I can't imagine

2663
02:05:02,760 --> 02:05:00,130
as an archaeologist doing this and

2664
02:05:04,950 --> 02:05:02,770
having you have to figure out the

2665
02:05:06,990 --> 02:05:04,960
history of what is going on so let's

2666
02:05:11,810 --> 02:05:07,000
talk about that for a second what what

2667
02:05:16,229 --> 02:05:11,820
was the original find that was up there

2668
02:05:19,950 --> 02:05:16,239
well in 96 at the top of a volcano in

2669
02:05:22,350 --> 02:05:19,960
southwest Peru they found the body of a

2670
02:05:25,830 --> 02:05:22,360
15 year old girl and she'd apparently

2671
02:05:28,500 --> 02:05:25,840
frozen to death after she was left as a

2672
02:05:31,020 --> 02:05:28,510
sacrifice to the gods so three years

2673
02:05:33,750 --> 02:05:31,030
after that archaeologists discovered

2674
02:05:36,950 --> 02:05:33,760
three more frozen children who were also

2675
02:05:42,689 --> 02:05:36,960
sacrificed it was two girls and one boy

2676
02:05:44,760 --> 02:05:42,699
about 8 to 14 years old and so these

2677
02:05:46,890 --> 02:05:44,770
were Inca killed Rijn and what they

2678
02:05:49,950 --> 02:05:46,900
found and these were these are very

2679
02:05:52,250 --> 02:05:49,960
great specimens they're just amazing to

2680
02:05:55,650 --> 02:05:52,260
see I mean it's very sad very very

2681
02:05:57,180 --> 02:05:55,660
horrific but also very fascinating well

2682
02:06:00,540 --> 02:05:57,190
you can see from them is that they had

2683
02:06:04,110 --> 02:06:00,550
been fattened adorned and then given

2684
02:06:06,270 --> 02:06:04,120
hallucinogenic drugs before the priests

2685
02:06:09,390 --> 02:06:06,280
left them on the summit

2686
02:06:12,750 --> 02:06:09,400
of this mountain and volcano rather to

2687
02:06:14,640 --> 02:06:12,760
to just die it's so archeologists from

2688
02:06:17,340 --> 02:06:14,650
all over were wanting to study these

2689
02:06:20,040 --> 02:06:17,350
these children because they are the most

2690
02:06:22,220 --> 02:06:20,050
well-preserved mummies ever found some

2691
02:06:24,860 --> 02:06:22,230
of them at least I mean they they look I

2692
02:06:28,470 --> 02:06:24,870
didn't include a picture in the book

2693
02:06:31,710 --> 02:06:28,480
partly out of respect because it is a it

2694
02:06:33,290 --> 02:06:31,720
is a contentious subject a lot of people

2695
02:06:37,140 --> 02:06:33,300
are very upset that they're even on

2696
02:06:39,960 --> 02:06:37,150
display in a museum because these are

2697
02:06:42,540 --> 02:06:39,970
not your typical remains

2698
02:06:44,730 --> 02:06:42,550
these are children they look like

2699
02:06:46,590 --> 02:06:44,740
children still they're there so I mean

2700
02:06:48,120 --> 02:06:46,600
you can google and then if anyone's

2701
02:06:50,850 --> 02:06:48,130
interested in and definitely find frozen

2702
02:06:53,250 --> 02:06:50,860
Inca mummies and you'll be able to find

2703
02:06:55,410 --> 02:06:53,260
this pretty easily and you'll be able to

2704
02:06:57,000 --> 02:06:55,420
see that these well-preserved these

2705
02:07:00,150 --> 02:06:57,010
these well-preserved mummies they're

2706
02:07:01,830 --> 02:07:00,160
just it's chilling that's a terrible pun

2707
02:07:05,760 --> 02:07:01,840
I should have probably used that but

2708
02:07:07,470 --> 02:07:05,770
mmhmm yeah they were they they yes it

2709
02:07:09,840 --> 02:07:07,480
does make you look at it and it really

2710
02:07:12,000 --> 02:07:09,850
hits home that wow these were these were

2711
02:07:14,100 --> 02:07:12,010
children so it's easy to say mummies and

2712
02:07:15,420 --> 02:07:14,110
you know think of mummies curses and you

2713
02:07:17,670 --> 02:07:15,430
know archaeology and whatnot but then

2714
02:07:20,400 --> 02:07:17,680
when you see these children and how they

2715
02:07:22,650 --> 02:07:20,410
just they they die they froze to death

2716
02:07:26,250 --> 02:07:22,660
and they went a terrible way as well I

2717
02:07:27,990 --> 02:07:26,260
mean the you know having to be force-fed

2718
02:07:31,170 --> 02:07:28,000
and drugged and all these different

2719
02:07:34,290 --> 02:07:31,180
things it they went through some trauma

2720
02:07:37,530 --> 02:07:34,300
before dying and a horrific death but

2721
02:07:39,720 --> 02:07:37,540
their their bodily fluids even were in

2722
02:07:42,930 --> 02:07:39,730
their organs everything was still there

2723
02:07:46,080 --> 02:07:42,940
so it was because it was so well

2724
02:07:48,590 --> 02:07:46,090
preserved the the organs and whatnot the

2725
02:07:52,380 --> 02:07:48,600
researchers were able to do a complete

2726
02:07:54,110 --> 02:07:52,390
analysis on this to find all sorts of

2727
02:07:57,360 --> 02:07:54,120
information like their eating habits

2728
02:08:00,000 --> 02:07:57,370
illnesses and and in all sorts of things

2729
02:08:02,070 --> 02:08:00,010
so in one case yeah this would be a

2730
02:08:03,510 --> 02:08:02,080
terrible discovery to make and what on

2731
02:08:06,240 --> 02:08:03,520
one hand it'd be fascinating but the

2732
02:08:09,060 --> 02:08:06,250
other it would just be quite disturbing

2733
02:08:11,730 --> 02:08:09,070
because since they were so well intact

2734
02:08:14,100 --> 02:08:11,740
and frozen one of the children's hearts

2735
02:08:15,690 --> 02:08:14,110
was still filled with blood frozen blood

2736
02:08:17,790 --> 02:08:15,700
and they looked like they had just

2737
02:08:19,720 --> 02:08:17,800
simply fallen asleep and in these

2738
02:08:22,090 --> 02:08:19,730
mummies they were roughly

2739
02:08:24,790 --> 02:08:22,100
500 years old right and so what they

2740
02:08:26,860 --> 02:08:24,800
were looking at with children from 500

2741
02:08:31,120 --> 02:08:26,870
years ago with blood still in their

2742
02:08:33,220 --> 02:08:31,130
hearts and so you know the they've so

2743
02:08:34,810 --> 02:08:33,230
for anybody wants to google it you know

2744
02:08:37,510 --> 02:08:34,820
out of curiosity that the researchers

2745
02:08:43,060 --> 02:08:37,520
refer to children is lightning girl and

2746
02:08:47,020 --> 02:08:43,070
the boy they just call the boy but the

2747
02:08:49,240 --> 02:08:47,030
the girl her she was called lightning

2748
02:08:51,430 --> 02:08:49,250
girl because her body had been burned

2749
02:08:52,870 --> 02:08:51,440
after being struck by lightning after

2750
02:08:55,600 --> 02:08:52,880
her death I mean to add insult to injury

2751
02:08:57,640 --> 02:08:55,610
no you know for sure I was she was 6

2752
02:09:00,340 --> 02:08:57,650
years old at the time of her death her

2753
02:09:02,680 --> 02:09:00,350
skull was elongated and they had put her

2754
02:09:05,020 --> 02:09:02,690
in a nice dress and wrapped her in a

2755
02:09:06,910 --> 02:09:05,030
yellow and red blanket and so it

2756
02:09:08,229 --> 02:09:06,920
indicated that she was very well valued

2757
02:09:10,420 --> 02:09:08,239
that this wasn't somebody that they

2758
02:09:12,190 --> 02:09:10,430
thought you know we'll just send a

2759
02:09:15,190 --> 02:09:12,200
criminal up there we're punishing these

2760
02:09:17,590 --> 02:09:15,200
children if they fed them well they put

2761
02:09:20,170 --> 02:09:17,600
them in nice clothing they adorn them

2762
02:09:21,370 --> 02:09:20,180
these were the best of the best and so

2763
02:09:23,920 --> 02:09:21,380
you know nothing but the best isn't

2764
02:09:25,960 --> 02:09:23,930
offering of course for the cod so you

2765
02:09:29,220 --> 02:09:25,970
know they they took the boy who was 7

2766
02:09:32,050 --> 02:09:29,230
years old at the time of his death and

2767
02:09:34,270 --> 02:09:32,060
the boy didn't seem to go so willingly

2768
02:09:35,410 --> 02:09:34,280
it the researchers determined that it

2769
02:09:38,140 --> 02:09:35,420
looked like he had had a more of a

2770
02:09:41,200 --> 02:09:38,150
traumatic death he had vomit and blood

2771
02:09:43,810 --> 02:09:41,210
on his clothing and so his he also had

2772
02:09:47,110 --> 02:09:43,820
some dislocated bones and so it looks

2773
02:09:48,790 --> 02:09:47,120
like he may have been restrained and you

2774
02:09:50,950 --> 02:09:48,800
know may be fighting on his way so and

2775
02:09:53,500 --> 02:09:50,960
his skull was slightly elongated as well

2776
02:09:55,210 --> 02:09:53,510
and he worked a tunic and some silver

2777
02:09:57,580 --> 02:09:55,220
jewelry and he was also wrapped in a

2778
02:09:59,050 --> 02:09:57,590
blanket but it due to the way he was

2779
02:10:01,570 --> 02:09:59,060
restrained it was believed that he may

2780
02:10:06,100 --> 02:10:01,580
have been suffocated after fighting off

2781
02:10:07,690 --> 02:10:06,110
the eventual fate so how do you as an

2782
02:10:10,300 --> 02:10:07,700
archaeologist when you go through

2783
02:10:12,880 --> 02:10:10,310
something like this how do you prevent

2784
02:10:15,010 --> 02:10:12,890
emotional trauma I mean you've got to

2785
02:10:16,900 --> 02:10:15,020
take this stuff home you have to yeah

2786
02:10:17,979 --> 02:10:16,910
you have to think about this not only

2787
02:10:20,220 --> 02:10:17,989
that you have to write up the report

2788
02:10:23,560 --> 02:10:20,230
you've got to take pictures you have to

2789
02:10:26,050 --> 02:10:23,570
archive catalog you have to bag and tag

2790
02:10:30,070 --> 02:10:26,060
you have to do all of these things how

2791
02:10:31,300 --> 02:10:30,080
do you keep your mind straight yeah I

2792
02:10:32,949 --> 02:10:31,310
mean that's a good question I think

2793
02:10:35,469 --> 02:10:32,959
that's something that

2794
02:10:37,029 --> 02:10:35,479
most people in in any of these sorts of

2795
02:10:40,060 --> 02:10:37,039
professions even just the medical field

2796
02:10:42,669 --> 02:10:40,070
or you know policing there's so many

2797
02:10:44,709 --> 02:10:42,679
things that that you know it would leave

2798
02:10:46,779 --> 02:10:44,719
you to have to deal with trauma this way

2799
02:10:48,639 --> 02:10:46,789
and and perhaps there comes with that

2800
02:10:51,069 --> 02:10:48,649
and practice some sort of professional

2801
02:10:52,869 --> 02:10:51,079
you know distance but I don't really

2802
02:10:54,459 --> 02:10:52,879
think so because these aren't things

2803
02:10:56,319 --> 02:10:54,469
that you'd typically find so I think you

2804
02:10:58,299 --> 02:10:56,329
could spend a lot of your time as an

2805
02:10:59,889 --> 02:10:58,309
archaeologist researching and finding

2806
02:11:02,319 --> 02:10:59,899
you know if it's a pottery and and

2807
02:11:04,270 --> 02:11:02,329
whatnot and then maybe find something

2808
02:11:07,389 --> 02:11:04,280
like this and maybe be totally

2809
02:11:09,639 --> 02:11:07,399
unprepared for it yeah I know you

2810
02:11:14,409 --> 02:11:09,649
brought this up a few times tonight we

2811
02:11:19,149 --> 02:11:14,419
all picture digs right with the pottery

2812
02:11:23,109 --> 02:11:19,159
shards that's all it's about and it's

2813
02:11:24,939 --> 02:11:23,119
clearly not and one of the things that

2814
02:11:27,729 --> 02:11:24,949
you pointed out in this book and I love

2815
02:11:32,229 --> 02:11:27,739
learning something new but the bog

2816
02:11:34,509 --> 02:11:32,239
mummies now just like the the frozen

2817
02:11:38,739 --> 02:11:34,519
Inca mummies I've never heard of a bog

2818
02:11:42,040 --> 02:11:38,749
mummy and the ability for a bog and peat

2819
02:11:44,560 --> 02:11:42,050
moss and the nature of the soil -

2820
02:11:48,189 --> 02:11:44,570
perfectly preserved bodies and they are

2821
02:11:50,290 --> 02:11:48,199
found all the time aren't they yes yes

2822
02:11:52,540 --> 02:11:50,300
actually they're they're very well

2823
02:11:54,189 --> 02:11:52,550
preserved because of the as you said the

2824
02:11:58,869 --> 02:11:54,199
the peat and these sorts of things and

2825
02:12:02,649 --> 02:11:58,879
so yeah yeah the that that's a really

2826
02:12:04,270 --> 02:12:02,659
interesting one that people were sort of

2827
02:12:06,939 --> 02:12:04,280
confused about for a little while and

2828
02:12:09,279 --> 02:12:06,949
then they ended up finding out that well

2829
02:12:12,339 --> 02:12:09,289
earliest assuming that this had to do

2830
02:12:13,959 --> 02:12:12,349
with some sacred pagan rituals and so

2831
02:12:20,379 --> 02:12:13,969
and then some maybe were just accidents

2832
02:12:22,179 --> 02:12:20,389
people yeah but but in in Europe a lot

2833
02:12:24,369 --> 02:12:22,189
of the ones that they have found they

2834
02:12:27,969 --> 02:12:24,379
believe are victims of human sacrifice

2835
02:12:30,850 --> 02:12:27,979
and so but the peat is it's you get this

2836
02:12:32,529 --> 02:12:30,860
sometimes it's amazing where it sort of

2837
02:12:34,419 --> 02:12:32,539
like the liberated Tar Pits you know

2838
02:12:37,779 --> 02:12:34,429
there's these like areas these certain

2839
02:12:39,669 --> 02:12:37,789
ways that the globe can just preserve

2840
02:12:41,469 --> 02:12:39,679
something you know and and then this is

2841
02:12:45,089 --> 02:12:41,479
one of those cases where because of the

2842
02:12:47,609 --> 02:12:45,099
acidity in the peat it's

2843
02:12:49,560 --> 02:12:47,619
it just perfectly preserves these bodies

2844
02:12:52,410 --> 02:12:49,570
so much so they you can see their hair

2845
02:12:56,220 --> 02:12:52,420
and all these details and so we're

2846
02:12:59,879 --> 02:12:56,230
talking like very old but in in 1897

2847
02:13:02,640 --> 02:12:59,889
there were workers out illegally burning

2848
02:13:04,709 --> 02:13:02,650
peat and then they discovered a body in

2849
02:13:08,220 --> 02:13:04,719
the in the peat bog near their village

2850
02:13:10,620 --> 02:13:08,230
this was in the Netherlands but it

2851
02:13:12,780 --> 02:13:10,630
scared them they thought they they may

2852
02:13:14,580 --> 02:13:12,790
be unearthed the devil you know they

2853
02:13:16,319 --> 02:13:14,590
didn't know what they found but you know

2854
02:13:17,609 --> 02:13:16,329
they were very you know superstitious

2855
02:13:19,890 --> 02:13:17,619
and whatnot but what they really found

2856
02:13:22,229 --> 02:13:19,900
was a teenage girl who had been in the

2857
02:13:24,439 --> 02:13:22,239
bog and now get this this was she she

2858
02:13:29,430 --> 02:13:24,449
looked like a girl but she was there for

2859
02:13:32,970 --> 02:13:29,440
2,000 years 2000 years 2000 years fully

2860
02:13:35,189 --> 02:13:32,980
clothed fully clothed she was she had a

2861
02:13:37,770 --> 02:13:35,199
half shaved head and a rope around her

2862
02:13:39,330 --> 02:13:37,780
neck now see this is the thing ok let's

2863
02:13:41,609 --> 02:13:39,340
let's actually this is part of

2864
02:13:45,359 --> 02:13:41,619
archeology right here now you get to

2865
02:13:47,669 --> 02:13:45,369
write the story right where you have a

2866
02:13:49,979 --> 02:13:47,679
body its clothed then you find out it's

2867
02:13:53,160 --> 02:13:49,989
2000 years old it's got a she's got a

2868
02:13:55,770 --> 02:13:53,170
rope around her neck her hair is you

2869
02:13:58,439 --> 02:13:55,780
know that situation where she's half

2870
02:14:01,350 --> 02:13:58,449
shaved now they start to take a look at

2871
02:14:04,050 --> 02:14:01,360
this and they they they figure out you

2872
02:14:06,240 --> 02:14:04,060
know they get to play and see is right

2873
02:14:11,359 --> 02:14:06,250
crime scene investigation what happened

2874
02:14:16,439 --> 02:14:11,369
to her well what's interesting is that

2875
02:14:18,569 --> 02:14:16,449
the well the mayor actually it was since

2876
02:14:20,129 --> 02:14:18,579
this was so long ago and you know the

2877
02:14:22,229 --> 02:14:20,139
the news started spreading in this

2878
02:14:24,689 --> 02:14:22,239
village and so the mayor had to come by

2879
02:14:26,399 --> 02:14:24,699
and report the discovery to the museum

2880
02:14:28,890 --> 02:14:26,409
and sort of you know act as an

2881
02:14:31,530 --> 02:14:28,900
intermediary and so we have a primary

2882
02:14:34,109 --> 02:14:31,540
source document that shows what he

2883
02:14:36,000 --> 02:14:34,119
described exactly and so the body he

2884
02:14:38,669 --> 02:14:36,010
described as having blue skin and damage

2885
02:14:40,709 --> 02:14:38,679
to the right cheek the mouth was open

2886
02:14:44,359 --> 02:14:40,719
and there were still teeth and the girl

2887
02:14:46,830 --> 02:14:44,369
had long reddish hair but then again the

2888
02:14:49,649 --> 02:14:46,840
the right side of the skull it was was

2889
02:14:51,569 --> 02:14:49,659
clean shaved so it was really strange

2890
02:14:54,000 --> 02:14:51,579
and you know they had this they do

2891
02:14:56,250 --> 02:14:54,010
really didn't I don't think they really

2892
02:14:57,709 --> 02:14:56,260
did anything with it from that point but

2893
02:15:01,669 --> 02:14:57,719
then later archaeologists

2894
02:15:03,979 --> 02:15:01,679
discovering that other parts of her body

2895
02:15:07,310 --> 02:15:03,989
and clothing were being dug up by the

2896
02:15:09,979 --> 02:15:07,320
villagers her teeth had been stolen her

2897
02:15:11,779 --> 02:15:09,989
hair was pulled loose so it's like they

2898
02:15:13,549 --> 02:15:11,789
were robbing her grave at one point and

2899
02:15:14,870 --> 02:15:13,559
but it there was nothing from her grave

2900
02:15:19,790 --> 02:15:14,880
it was just they were taking pieces of

2901
02:15:22,850 --> 02:15:19,800
her all throughout time and so what they

2902
02:15:25,129 --> 02:15:22,860
determined based on just sort of this

2903
02:15:29,149 --> 02:15:25,139
activity and again this is this is where

2904
02:15:31,310 --> 02:15:29,159
archaeology gets a little let I don't

2905
02:15:33,200 --> 02:15:31,320
want to say less than scientific but it

2906
02:15:34,759 --> 02:15:33,210
is a soft science and this is something

2907
02:15:38,029 --> 02:15:34,769
I think is really important to point out

2908
02:15:40,250 --> 02:15:38,039
because so often archaeologists would

2909
02:15:42,069 --> 02:15:40,260
like to point to their discipline as

2910
02:15:44,839 --> 02:15:42,079
being a science and while there are

2911
02:15:47,209 --> 02:15:44,849
scientific tools used and there is a

2912
02:15:49,430 --> 02:15:47,219
scientific methodology employed it

2913
02:15:51,799 --> 02:15:49,440
doesn't necessarily mean that it's all

2914
02:15:53,930 --> 02:15:51,809
quantifiable you still have to take a

2915
02:15:55,850 --> 02:15:53,940
lot of guesses even if they're educated

2916
02:15:57,739 --> 02:15:55,860
guesses and you have to do qualitative

2917
02:16:00,350 --> 02:15:57,749
analysis and do a lot of inferring and

2918
02:16:02,239 --> 02:16:00,360
so which I don't think is necessarily a

2919
02:16:03,979 --> 02:16:02,249
bad thing but it's just an important

2920
02:16:05,600 --> 02:16:03,989
thing to keep in mind when you hear

2921
02:16:07,430 --> 02:16:05,610
archaeologists sometimes go and say no

2922
02:16:09,290 --> 02:16:07,440
this is definitely what this is because

2923
02:16:11,509 --> 02:16:09,300
good but know when you're talking about

2924
02:16:14,149 --> 02:16:11,519
the past unless you were there you

2925
02:16:16,969 --> 02:16:14,159
really definitely can't say much you

2926
02:16:20,330 --> 02:16:16,979
know so you know at this point the story

2927
02:16:23,870 --> 02:16:20,340
that they put together was that she was

2928
02:16:26,959 --> 02:16:23,880
16 years old when she died and she had a

2929
02:16:29,989 --> 02:16:26,969
spine abnormality that maybe caused her

2930
02:16:31,879 --> 02:16:29,999
to limp and so what they figured was

2931
02:16:33,290 --> 02:16:31,889
that you know and they could tell that

2932
02:16:35,209 --> 02:16:33,300
it wasn't that she had a broken spine

2933
02:16:37,490 --> 02:16:35,219
that was done it was definitely from

2934
02:16:40,339 --> 02:16:37,500
birth that she had this spinal you know

2935
02:16:43,309 --> 02:16:40,349
issue so what they what they believe is

2936
02:16:44,660 --> 02:16:43,319
that because she might have limped or

2937
02:16:48,440 --> 02:16:44,670
been just sort of having a crooked

2938
02:16:50,150 --> 02:16:48,450
stature it made her different and her

2939
02:16:52,610 --> 02:16:50,160
community didn't like her because of

2940
02:16:54,709 --> 02:16:52,620
that and and chased her off and abused

2941
02:16:56,450 --> 02:16:54,719
her and ended up killing her and so

2942
02:16:58,070 --> 02:16:56,460
that's that's sort of the idea now of

2943
02:16:59,269 --> 02:16:58,080
course we have no real way of proving

2944
02:17:02,450 --> 02:16:59,279
that but that's sort of the narrative

2945
02:17:05,330 --> 02:17:02,460
that they they put together but in the

2946
02:17:07,700 --> 02:17:05,340
90s University of Manchester had a

2947
02:17:08,929 --> 02:17:07,710
forensic artist reconstruct the girl's

2948
02:17:11,959 --> 02:17:08,939
face

2949
02:17:13,849 --> 02:17:11,969
and it's just it's amazing because it

2950
02:17:16,009 --> 02:17:13,859
really brings life to this I mean the

2951
02:17:18,410 --> 02:17:16,019
body was really well preserved but again

2952
02:17:20,299 --> 02:17:18,420
her face had been sort of abused and and

2953
02:17:22,609 --> 02:17:20,309
you know she had been treated poorly and

2954
02:17:24,319 --> 02:17:22,619
then if the people looted her and took

2955
02:17:26,599 --> 02:17:24,329
her teeth and did some things after the

2956
02:17:28,969 --> 02:17:26,609
fact so there is a reconstruction out

2957
02:17:31,339 --> 02:17:28,979
there that is it's quite amazing and it

2958
02:17:33,529 --> 02:17:31,349
really gives a literal face to this girl

2959
02:17:35,870 --> 02:17:33,539
of two thousand years ago that was

2960
02:17:37,099 --> 02:17:35,880
tortured to death literally because she

2961
02:17:44,389 --> 02:17:37,109
was different

2962
02:17:47,750 --> 02:17:44,399
things preserved her for us today

2963
02:17:51,169 --> 02:17:47,760
and including you know key things like

2964
02:17:54,290 --> 02:17:51,179
her clothes but of course the rope that

2965
02:17:55,939 --> 02:17:54,300
was found around her neck and if it

2966
02:17:57,410 --> 02:17:55,949
wasn't for the bog we wouldn't have had

2967
02:18:00,109 --> 02:17:57,420
this and she wouldn't have been able to

2968
02:18:02,149 --> 02:18:00,119
tell her story absolutely because you

2969
02:18:05,029 --> 02:18:02,159
know a rope being organic material like

2970
02:18:06,889 --> 02:18:05,039
that it would have not really lasted I

2971
02:18:09,620 --> 02:18:06,899
mean the the bog preserved it so that

2972
02:18:13,489 --> 02:18:09,630
she was able to tell her story 2,000

2973
02:18:15,969 --> 02:18:13,499
years later now and speaking okay and as

2974
02:18:18,439 --> 02:18:15,979
we start to close tonight there is

2975
02:18:23,149 --> 02:18:18,449
another question that just needs to be

2976
02:18:27,669 --> 02:18:23,159
addressed when when a when a when a

2977
02:18:31,609 --> 02:18:27,679
skull is revealed to have a hole in it I

2978
02:18:35,209 --> 02:18:31,619
think a normal assumption for us that

2979
02:18:39,019 --> 02:18:35,219
are not archaeologists is that it's an

2980
02:18:41,979 --> 02:18:39,029
arrow right it's that it was a murder it

2981
02:18:44,779 --> 02:18:41,989
was you know is some maybe even battle

2982
02:18:48,500 --> 02:18:44,789
something like that happened but it

2983
02:18:51,589 --> 02:18:48,510
could have been a demonic possession and

2984
02:18:53,689 --> 02:18:51,599
an exorcism as an archaeologist how do

2985
02:18:57,469 --> 02:18:53,699
you figure that out because isn't a hole

2986
02:18:59,629 --> 02:18:57,479
a hole yes no holes a hole but you can

2987
02:19:04,549 --> 02:18:59,639
look at it and determine how the hole

2988
02:19:07,279 --> 02:19:04,559
got there based on well one one way you

2989
02:19:10,519 --> 02:19:07,289
can see is if it was perforated around

2990
02:19:12,559 --> 02:19:10,529
the edge so in order to purposefully

2991
02:19:15,739 --> 02:19:12,569
drill a hole so surgically drill a hole

2992
02:19:17,449 --> 02:19:15,749
in very ancient times it would be you

2993
02:19:22,030 --> 02:19:17,459
would make little perforations around

2994
02:19:23,740 --> 02:19:22,040
that and then push that skull piece in

2995
02:19:25,839 --> 02:19:23,750
and you'd have a little skull disk so

2996
02:19:27,519 --> 02:19:25,849
that would leave any indeed remove that

2997
02:19:30,429 --> 02:19:27,529
skull disk but then that would leave a

2998
02:19:31,480 --> 02:19:30,439
particular outline around it and so

2999
02:19:32,950 --> 02:19:31,490
there's a lot of different ways you'd

3000
02:19:35,860 --> 02:19:32,960
look at the skull to determine if it was

3001
02:19:38,620 --> 02:19:35,870
a blunt-force or if it was drilling you

3002
02:19:40,509 --> 02:19:38,630
know that which happened frequently for

3003
02:19:42,940 --> 02:19:40,519
that sort of thing so yeah there's a lot

3004
02:19:44,500 --> 02:19:42,950
of ways so I mentioned in the book one

3005
02:19:48,370 --> 02:19:44,510
way that they did it I sort of start

3006
02:19:50,650 --> 02:19:48,380
this part of the book with what seems to

3007
02:19:53,820 --> 02:19:50,660
be a fictionalized account or retelling

3008
02:19:57,730 --> 02:19:53,830
of an actual trepan

3009
02:19:59,320 --> 02:19:57,740
historic exorcism but it's because

3010
02:20:01,660 --> 02:19:59,330
nobody could be there to record it of

3011
02:20:03,580 --> 02:20:01,670
course it's it's speculative but I base

3012
02:20:06,219 --> 02:20:03,590
it on all of the evidence that is

3013
02:20:07,990 --> 02:20:06,229
available on how they held they would

3014
02:20:09,370 --> 02:20:08,000
have done this and what you know what

3015
02:20:10,900 --> 02:20:09,380
evidence we have and one of the things

3016
02:20:13,300 --> 02:20:10,910
is that they would have taken an an

3017
02:20:15,700 --> 02:20:13,310
antler or something to that effect and

3018
02:20:18,190 --> 02:20:15,710
whittled it to a point and then they

3019
02:20:21,820 --> 02:20:18,200
would have just you know perforated

3020
02:20:23,889 --> 02:20:21,830
around the head and then started rubbing

3021
02:20:25,389 --> 02:20:23,899
that in their palm as though sort of

3022
02:20:27,400 --> 02:20:25,399
they were gonna start a fire or

3023
02:20:30,130 --> 02:20:27,410
something so and so if you could imagine

3024
02:20:32,950 --> 02:20:30,140
how awful that would be if you were a

3025
02:20:34,719 --> 02:20:32,960
patient suffering from maybe epilepsy or

3026
02:20:38,010 --> 02:20:34,729
some disease that maybe they were

3027
02:20:40,780 --> 02:20:38,020
thinking was a you know a form of

3028
02:20:43,000 --> 02:20:40,790
exposition or something like that you

3029
02:20:45,130 --> 02:20:43,010
would you to add insult again to your

3030
02:20:47,710 --> 02:20:45,140
injury you would have a shaman standing

3031
02:20:50,380 --> 02:20:47,720
over you drilling a hole in your head

3032
02:20:52,840 --> 02:20:50,390
with whittled down antler which would

3033
02:20:54,670 --> 02:20:52,850
take quite a while to do now after a

3034
02:20:56,290 --> 02:20:54,680
while the shaman would you know he'd be

3035
02:20:58,150 --> 02:20:56,300
pretty good at it after a while so it

3036
02:21:00,280 --> 02:20:58,160
wouldn't be as bad as maybe if I would

3037
02:21:02,620 --> 02:21:00,290
do it but still it'd be a horrific

3038
02:21:05,889 --> 02:21:02,630
experience and then once they had that

3039
02:21:08,380 --> 02:21:05,899
skull disc popped out you know they

3040
02:21:10,030 --> 02:21:08,390
would have to clean that off and then

3041
02:21:12,670 --> 02:21:10,040
how they would do that would they would

3042
02:21:14,080 --> 02:21:12,680
urinate in the hole and then they would

3043
02:21:15,490 --> 02:21:14,090
need to pack that hole because they

3044
02:21:17,620 --> 02:21:15,500
wouldn't put the skull disc back in that

3045
02:21:19,900 --> 02:21:17,630
would be a trophy for later unless you

3046
02:21:21,610 --> 02:21:19,910
wanted to keep the the injury open

3047
02:21:24,429 --> 02:21:21,620
because you know that's how you maybe

3048
02:21:26,710 --> 02:21:24,439
let the demons get out or um you you

3049
02:21:30,309 --> 02:21:26,720
help with the inter-cranial pressure so

3050
02:21:31,990 --> 02:21:30,319
you would pack that hole with reindeer

3051
02:21:34,921 --> 02:21:32,000
fat or whatever animal fat you may have

3052
02:21:41,480 --> 02:21:34,931
and then basically hope for the best

3053
02:21:44,700 --> 02:21:41,490
now when when the Exorcist the movie was

3054
02:21:47,881 --> 02:21:44,710
number one and then of course later on

3055
02:21:52,291 --> 02:21:47,891
with the omen but the Exorcist and you

3056
02:21:53,100 --> 02:21:52,301
and I in this country went through front

3057
02:21:55,711 --> 02:21:53,110
page

3058
02:21:57,930 --> 02:21:55,721
demonic possession stories on every

3059
02:21:59,640 --> 02:21:57,940
newspaper across this country right it

3060
02:22:03,980 --> 02:21:59,650
was everywhere and everybody was

3061
02:22:08,520 --> 02:22:03,990
possessed it doesn't seem that way today

3062
02:22:11,100 --> 02:22:08,530
have we moved on from evil are we past

3063
02:22:15,871 --> 02:22:11,110
demonic possession are we understanding

3064
02:22:18,541 --> 02:22:15,881
that is it not religious is it is it

3065
02:22:21,690 --> 02:22:18,551
something else and another medical issue

3066
02:22:23,910 --> 02:22:21,700
I mean it's great fodder for Hollywood

3067
02:22:26,280 --> 02:22:23,920
you know those movies will always be

3068
02:22:27,421 --> 02:22:26,290
made and they still are but do you

3069
02:22:31,051 --> 02:22:27,431
understand what I'm asking

3070
02:22:33,511 --> 02:22:31,061
yeah yeah you know what I I was curious

3071
02:22:36,331 --> 02:22:33,521
about this as well and so I interviewed

3072
02:22:38,970 --> 02:22:36,341
an exorcist for the book and he's an

3073
02:22:41,041 --> 02:22:38,980
actual working modern-day Exorcist and

3074
02:22:43,680 --> 02:22:41,051
he had said that he's actually seen an

3075
02:22:47,041 --> 02:22:43,690
increase in his business a lot of people

3076
02:22:49,081 --> 02:22:47,051
needing exorcisms and I interviewed him

3077
02:22:51,900 --> 02:22:49,091
for the book his name was Bill bean but

3078
02:22:53,791 --> 02:22:51,910
I'd also talked to Exorcist before they

3079
02:22:56,400 --> 02:22:53,801
didn't include necessarily in the book

3080
02:22:58,530 --> 02:22:56,410
and they all said similar things that

3081
02:23:00,810 --> 02:22:58,540
there is actually an increase in people

3082
02:23:02,671 --> 02:23:00,820
looking for exorcisms so that was a

3083
02:23:05,671 --> 02:23:02,681
little bit strange I think it's just

3084
02:23:08,430 --> 02:23:05,681
maybe the way maybe the way they're

3085
02:23:10,860 --> 02:23:08,440
being conducted is different I put in

3086
02:23:13,850 --> 02:23:10,870
the book my own eye witness account of a

3087
02:23:16,440 --> 02:23:13,860
modern-day exorcism that you know as a

3088
02:23:20,251 --> 02:23:16,450
recovering Catholic or former Catholic I

3089
02:23:22,320 --> 02:23:20,261
am I think of exorcism as The Exorcist

3090
02:23:26,220 --> 02:23:22,330
and a priest and some holy water and all

3091
02:23:29,310 --> 02:23:26,230
this and so when I saw my own exorcism

3092
02:23:31,350 --> 02:23:29,320
you know I it was nothing like that it

3093
02:23:35,970 --> 02:23:31,360
was very strange and very different and

3094
02:23:37,350 --> 02:23:35,980
so I think what we have is maybe just a

3095
02:23:40,020 --> 02:23:37,360
different look of it it's something it's

3096
02:23:42,360 --> 02:23:40,030
something like that but in fact there

3097
02:23:44,310 --> 02:23:42,370
are psychiatrists and psychologists that

3098
02:23:45,510 --> 02:23:44,320
are starting to incorporate exorcism and

3099
02:23:47,040 --> 02:23:45,520
their practice

3100
02:23:48,780 --> 02:23:47,050
some of them even if they're not

3101
02:23:51,540 --> 02:23:48,790
religious they sort of believe that

3102
02:23:53,760 --> 02:23:51,550
perhaps there's a placebo effect or you

3103
02:23:56,460 --> 02:23:53,770
know something like that so maybe it

3104
02:23:58,740 --> 02:23:56,470
could do some good so I think we're just

3105
02:24:01,260 --> 02:23:58,750
seeing it evolve and change and maybe

3106
02:24:03,660 --> 02:24:01,270
sort of look a little different than how

3107
02:24:05,219 --> 02:24:03,670
popular culture put it out to us to

3108
02:24:08,160 --> 02:24:05,229
begin with with the whole you know

3109
02:24:11,580 --> 02:24:08,170
Catholic priest archetype and in this

3110
02:24:12,870 --> 02:24:11,590
but I think it's very much a relevant

3111
02:24:14,639 --> 02:24:12,880
thing in fact I know in the third world

3112
02:24:16,649 --> 02:24:14,649
they're still doing it and you know

3113
02:24:19,410 --> 02:24:16,659
doing a lot of it and it's quite sad

3114
02:24:22,740 --> 02:24:19,420
really they are people who have absolute

3115
02:24:24,450 --> 02:24:22,750
medical you know disorders epilepsy is

3116
02:24:27,540 --> 02:24:24,460
usually the most common one cited

3117
02:24:30,030 --> 02:24:27,550
they're being treated by being given

3118
02:24:32,250 --> 02:24:30,040
exorcisms and sometimes they die as a

3119
02:24:33,689 --> 02:24:32,260
result because these are very it's not

3120
02:24:35,399 --> 02:24:33,699
like somebody standing over you saying

3121
02:24:36,750 --> 02:24:35,409
begone demon and the power of Christ

3122
02:24:39,149 --> 02:24:36,760
compels you or something like that it's

3123
02:24:41,070 --> 02:24:39,159
like they get physically restrained they

3124
02:24:42,540 --> 02:24:41,080
they go through starvation they go

3125
02:24:48,059 --> 02:24:42,550
through a lot of traumatic things and

3126
02:24:52,050 --> 02:24:48,069
and can actually die so hold on for a

3127
02:24:56,189 --> 02:24:52,060
second you reference that's right that's

3128
02:25:02,880 --> 02:24:56,199
what it was may we no longer fear any

3129
02:25:04,979 --> 02:25:02,890
evil yeah which is and how do you how do

3130
02:25:07,649 --> 02:25:04,989
you write it here it's a it comes from

3131
02:25:11,370 --> 02:25:07,659
the last few lines of the Catholic Rite

3132
02:25:17,820 --> 02:25:11,380
of exorcism so may we no longer fear

3133
02:25:19,740 --> 02:25:17,830
evil I think that I think that we do I

3134
02:25:22,740 --> 02:25:19,750
think that we will always I think that

3135
02:25:24,840 --> 02:25:22,750
even with science see this is this is

3136
02:25:26,460 --> 02:25:24,850
what's interesting is that you have

3137
02:25:28,410 --> 02:25:26,470
science and it sort of lulls you into

3138
02:25:30,660 --> 02:25:28,420
the sense of that we have a grip on it

3139
02:25:32,370 --> 02:25:30,670
let me know I think we have we suffer

3140
02:25:35,280 --> 02:25:32,380
from hubris after a while because we

3141
02:25:37,410 --> 02:25:35,290
know you know the unknowable at times it

3142
02:25:39,359 --> 02:25:37,420
seems and then there's these anomalous

3143
02:25:42,599 --> 02:25:39,369
things that happen that we can't explain

3144
02:25:45,269 --> 02:25:42,609
whether it be an encounter whether it's

3145
02:25:48,000 --> 02:25:45,279
something we call evil whether it's just

3146
02:25:50,700 --> 02:25:48,010
anything just out of the ordinary these

3147
02:25:53,729 --> 02:25:50,710
are things that you know that science

3148
02:25:55,830 --> 02:25:53,739
maybe doesn't explain very well or at

3149
02:25:58,260 --> 02:25:55,840
least not to our satisfaction and so I

3150
02:26:00,269 --> 02:25:58,270
think it leaves the possibility open and

3151
02:26:02,279 --> 02:26:00,279
as circling back to what we were talking

3152
02:26:03,809 --> 02:26:02,289
about in the beginning wherever whenever

3153
02:26:06,149 --> 02:26:03,819
that happens their leaves there's a

3154
02:26:08,340 --> 02:26:06,159
vacuum that's left and that vacuum seeks

3155
02:26:10,679 --> 02:26:08,350
to be filled and so in an effort to fill

3156
02:26:13,109 --> 02:26:10,689
that I think we will sometimes just call

3157
02:26:16,740 --> 02:26:13,119
something evil or demon or or whatnot

3158
02:26:19,710 --> 02:26:16,750
but I think that we're always going to

3159
02:26:21,660 --> 02:26:19,720
have us a fear even if we're not even if

3160
02:26:22,859 --> 02:26:21,670
we think we know I think that there's

3161
02:26:27,029 --> 02:26:22,869
always going to be things that we can't

3162
02:26:29,069 --> 02:26:27,039
truly know and in fear it's the fear of

3163
02:26:31,950 --> 02:26:29,079
the unknown a lot of people can't handle

3164
02:26:33,059 --> 02:26:31,960
that idea but just the idea that they

3165
02:26:35,040 --> 02:26:33,069
don't know something it's very

3166
02:26:36,479 --> 02:26:35,050
threatening to them I'm quite

3167
02:26:37,950 --> 02:26:36,489
comfortable with that I actually enjoy

3168
02:26:39,389 --> 02:26:37,960
it I don't want to know everything I

3169
02:26:40,920 --> 02:26:39,399
take that back I want to know everything

3170
02:26:42,479 --> 02:26:40,930
but I'm glad that I can't know

3171
02:26:44,490 --> 02:26:42,489
everything because it keeps me going

3172
02:26:46,109 --> 02:26:44,500
that's right some but some people are

3173
02:26:47,960 --> 02:26:46,119
afraid of that they want to feel secure

3174
02:26:50,939 --> 02:26:47,970
that they know every single thing and

3175
02:26:53,309 --> 02:26:50,949
instead of sitting with that just saying

3176
02:26:56,099 --> 02:26:53,319
I can't know everything some things are

3177
02:26:58,349 --> 02:26:56,109
unknowable I think that that's what

3178
02:27:01,469 --> 02:26:58,359
makes people afraid the book is

3179
02:27:05,010 --> 02:27:01,479
excellent and where can everybody go and

3180
02:27:08,760 --> 02:27:05,020
find it it is everywhere right now it's

3181
02:27:10,139 --> 02:27:08,770
on Amazon Kindle in his uh it's and

3182
02:27:12,510 --> 02:27:10,149
there's an audiobook version which is

3183
02:27:14,219 --> 02:27:12,520
quite nice and there is uh well it's in

3184
02:27:16,139 --> 02:27:14,229
Barnes and Noble books a million

3185
02:27:18,120 --> 02:27:16,149
anywhere books are sold you can find it

3186
02:27:20,460 --> 02:27:18,130
everywhere now thank you so much Heather

3187
02:27:22,889 --> 02:27:20,470
great conversation tonight and I look

3188
02:27:24,809 --> 02:27:22,899
forward to your next book thank you so

3189
02:27:26,429 --> 02:27:24,819
much thank you so much for having me

3190
02:27:29,910 --> 02:27:26,439
have a great night and thank you to the

3191
02:27:31,319 --> 02:27:29,920
fate or nuts you got see right there dr.

3192
02:27:32,969 --> 02:27:31,329
heather Lynn thank you so much Heather I

3193
02:27:36,330 --> 02:27:32,979
have a great night you too

3194
02:27:37,559 --> 02:27:36,340
she said fate or not that's what I'm

3195
02:27:41,309 --> 02:27:37,569
talking about I'm gonna take a break

3196
02:27:43,080 --> 02:27:41,319
right here the book is evil archeology

3197
02:27:44,910 --> 02:27:43,090
the links are over at Jimmy Church

3198
02:27:47,069 --> 02:27:44,920
radio.com and of course we've got them

3199
02:27:49,349 --> 02:27:47,079
up there and Twitter it's a fantastic

3200
02:27:51,330 --> 02:27:49,359
read thank you so much Heather this is

3201
02:27:53,370 --> 02:27:51,340
fade to black I'm your host Jimmy Church

3202
02:27:57,080 --> 02:27:53,380
and I'll be right back after this short

3203
02:28:23,280 --> 02:28:20,630
[Music]

3204
02:28:25,261 --> 02:28:23,290
come back here and you are listening to

3205
02:28:30,690 --> 02:28:25,271
my boy Jimmy Church

3206
02:28:33,841 --> 02:28:30,700
Jimmy Church radio.com this my popular

3207
02:28:45,020 --> 02:28:33,851
opinion reading a book will not make you

3208
02:28:47,761 --> 02:28:45,030
smarter hurricanes earthquakes wildfires

3209
02:28:50,160 --> 02:28:47,771
this year we've experienced more than

3210
02:28:52,080 --> 02:28:50,170
our fair share this is Jimmy Church a

3211
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fade to black and last month I decided

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to make sure my family does not have to

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those times of duress all new manna

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tasted and tested I own it now you can

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just click on the new manna banner on

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a discount we'll send you an autograph

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fade to black t-shirt seriously gobekli

3232
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tepe this is Jimmy Church of fade to

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black and I take life change tea

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do click on their banner ad Jimmy Church

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indonesian and african mixed in and then

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roast it to the dark side of fade to

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like the bunker leaning further into the

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3255
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3256
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3257
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hi folks CBD is the home run hitter for

3258
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health right now why do you ask because

3259
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of what it does for the body

3260
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unfortunately I can't tell you all about

3261
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the benefit you know there's reasons do

3262
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your due diligence and log on to ancient

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3267
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3268
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oil calm that's ancient life oil calm

3269
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this is Jimmy Church of fade to black

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and my family is safe because of new

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manna emergency food storage just go to

3272
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the new manna banner at Jimmy Church

3273
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3274
02:31:42,171 --> 02:31:39,660
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3281
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3284
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it's not a lifestyle we chose we were

3285
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born this way k GRA radio.com this is KJ

3286
02:32:34,870 --> 02:32:43,819
[Music]

3287
02:32:50,459 --> 02:32:46,829
welcome back fade to black coming OCB

3288
02:32:53,309 --> 02:32:50,469
Church opening up the phone lines seven

3289
02:32:56,760 --> 02:32:53,319
four seven two two eight two zero five

3290
02:33:00,029 --> 02:32:56,770
one seven four seven two two eight two

3291
02:33:02,279 --> 02:33:00,039
zero five one and I want to thank dr.

3292
02:33:05,909 --> 02:33:02,289
heather Lynn for an amazing conversation

3293
02:33:09,659 --> 02:33:05,919
tonight and I gotta tell you just like

3294
02:33:11,279 --> 02:33:09,669
what this book did to me that's what

3295
02:33:14,249 --> 02:33:11,289
that conversation tonight I mean that's

3296
02:33:17,340 --> 02:33:14,259
what archaeologists are going through

3297
02:33:21,929 --> 02:33:17,350
all the time and and bringing up things

3298
02:33:23,519 --> 02:33:21,939
like you know justjust things a hole in

3299
02:33:25,619 --> 02:33:23,529
the head well how did it get there

3300
02:33:31,349 --> 02:33:25,629
what's going on with that or the bog

3301
02:33:33,959 --> 02:33:31,359
mummies the Inca mummies are or the her

3302
02:33:36,239 --> 02:33:33,969
time in Germany that's a that's an

3303
02:33:39,989 --> 02:33:36,249
entire village that was only around for

3304
02:33:43,529 --> 02:33:39,999
50 years and they find five hundred

3305
02:33:44,550 --> 02:33:43,539
bodies that apparently were eaten and

3306
02:33:49,739 --> 02:33:44,560
cooked

3307
02:33:52,769 --> 02:33:49,749
that's wolf ah you know and at going

3308
02:33:55,169 --> 02:33:52,779
back to ancient Sumer and of course what

3309
02:33:59,939 --> 02:33:55,179
was going on in Egypt I didn't even get

3310
02:34:04,340 --> 02:33:59,949
to this is have mentioned this before

3311
02:34:07,909 --> 02:34:04,350
but think about this for a second you

3312
02:34:11,879 --> 02:34:07,919
live in England think about how many

3313
02:34:17,399 --> 02:34:11,889
medieval battles that went on all across

3314
02:34:23,309 --> 02:34:17,409
that country where thousands of soldiers

3315
02:34:26,159 --> 02:34:23,319
died right with that that's think about

3316
02:34:29,699 --> 02:34:26,169
that right and as an archaeologist and

3317
02:34:33,209 --> 02:34:29,709
you go and you're digging into a

3318
02:34:36,239 --> 02:34:33,219
battlefield which you are going to find

3319
02:34:38,669 --> 02:34:36,249
there and that's that's that's something

3320
02:34:41,129 --> 02:34:38,679
I don't know as far as the trauma goes

3321
02:34:45,689 --> 02:34:41,139
as an archaeologist what you go through

3322
02:34:49,409 --> 02:34:45,699
there is absolutely unbelievable to me I

3323
02:34:52,199 --> 02:34:49,419
don't know talk about PTSD right okay

3324
02:34:55,341 --> 02:34:52,209
I'm putting you on hold it's going to go

3325
02:34:57,051 --> 02:34:55,351
silent and I'm gonna go here first

3326
02:35:01,580 --> 02:34:57,061
and here we go hi you're live on fade to

3327
02:35:04,461 --> 02:35:01,590
black who's calling hi this is a Steven

3328
02:35:06,921 --> 02:35:04,471
padilla for Pahrump Nevada I want to

3329
02:35:10,060 --> 02:35:06,931
thank you for acknowledging me on

3330
02:35:14,180 --> 02:35:10,070
Facebook I purchase your everyday

3331
02:35:17,950 --> 02:35:14,190
Thank You Steven how are you I'm not too

3332
02:35:20,480 --> 02:35:17,960
bad not too bad I am UFO Bob I've been

3333
02:35:22,640 --> 02:35:20,490
falling in repose 50 years I think

3334
02:35:26,570 --> 02:35:22,650
collecting you're both Frutiger video

3335
02:35:31,160 --> 02:35:26,580
for 25 years but I really enjoy your

3336
02:35:33,560 --> 02:35:31,170
show what I'm so impressed and austere

3337
02:35:37,490 --> 02:35:33,570
with that you ask questions where your

3338
02:35:38,870 --> 02:35:37,500
listeners would be asking separates you

3339
02:35:41,301 --> 02:35:38,880
from the rest but you're right there

3340
02:35:41,870 --> 02:35:41,311
with Georgia Julie and Larry King you're

3341
02:35:44,270 --> 02:35:41,880
the best

3342
02:35:47,330 --> 02:35:44,280
well thank you for that Steven and and

3343
02:35:49,580 --> 02:35:47,340
and I do notice I do see you posting and

3344
02:35:51,921 --> 02:35:49,590
I really appreciate that so from all of

3345
02:35:53,421 --> 02:35:51,931
us here at fade to black I want to thank

3346
02:35:56,270 --> 02:35:53,431
you and and you're right there man

3347
02:36:01,600 --> 02:35:56,280
you're in you're in I count Eman you're

3348
02:36:05,360 --> 02:36:01,610
in Pahrump right right and yeah I'm

3349
02:36:07,761 --> 02:36:05,370
siding here with some were crying over

3350
02:36:09,131 --> 02:36:07,771
the mountain and they disappeared and it

3351
02:36:11,870 --> 02:36:09,141
looks like you're doing surveillance

3352
02:36:14,390 --> 02:36:11,880
it's about five or six orgs and they're

3353
02:36:15,740 --> 02:36:14,400
like transparent well you could they

3354
02:36:19,190 --> 02:36:15,750
weren't right

3355
02:36:21,291 --> 02:36:19,200
it's kind of like see-through them you

3356
02:36:24,650 --> 02:36:21,301
know and I've been collecting you for

3357
02:36:26,211 --> 02:36:24,660
products for 25 years and all the

3358
02:36:29,810 --> 02:36:26,221
pretties and most of the producer work

3359
02:36:31,881 --> 02:36:29,820
that we're getting now or orbs and the

3360
02:36:34,131 --> 02:36:31,891
way I see them come over the mountain on

3361
02:36:36,860 --> 02:36:34,141
the valley and this get there and look

3362
02:36:39,680 --> 02:36:36,870
at the routine surveillance and I think

3363
02:36:41,360 --> 02:36:39,690
personally at these orbs or intelligence

3364
02:36:43,070 --> 02:36:41,370
I think these are these the aliens

3365
02:36:46,610 --> 02:36:43,080
themselves that could transport

3366
02:36:50,421 --> 02:36:46,620
themselves into light and travel because

3367
02:36:52,551 --> 02:36:50,431
it's just amazing you know that's what I

3368
02:36:56,270 --> 02:36:52,561
saw and what the Verdes that people are

3369
02:36:58,430 --> 02:36:56,280
capturing now and there's good

3370
02:37:00,320 --> 02:36:58,440
intelligence behind these orbs there's

3371
02:37:01,710 --> 02:37:00,330
no doubt about that yeah I agree with

3372
02:37:05,880 --> 02:37:01,720
you I am

3373
02:37:07,979 --> 02:37:05,890
I've noticed the same trend and we've

3374
02:37:09,360 --> 02:37:07,989
gone through Steven as you know you've

3375
02:37:13,320 --> 02:37:09,370
been doing this for a while

3376
02:37:18,240 --> 02:37:13,330
that we we've got connections oh no I've

3377
02:37:21,000 --> 02:37:18,250
got you I've got you Steven maybe maybe

3378
02:37:23,670 --> 02:37:21,010
it's Pahrump okay

3379
02:37:30,360 --> 02:37:23,680
steven has lost us but I haven't lost I

3380
02:37:32,130 --> 02:37:30,370
haven't lost even is prompt Nevada and

3381
02:37:36,210 --> 02:37:32,140
that part of the world once you're out

3382
02:37:38,880 --> 02:37:36,220
there it's it's west and south west of

3383
02:37:40,349 --> 02:37:38,890
Las Vegas things have been going on out

3384
02:37:43,170 --> 02:37:40,359
there for a while but we've gone through

3385
02:37:46,050 --> 02:37:43,180
these phases we went through flying

3386
02:37:51,269 --> 02:37:46,060
saucers and then his cigar shaped craft

3387
02:37:55,889 --> 02:37:51,279
and and of course the black triangles

3388
02:37:58,349 --> 02:37:55,899
and the last you know 10 years or so the

3389
02:38:02,160 --> 02:37:58,359
last ten years or so it's been all about

3390
02:38:05,519 --> 02:38:02,170
these orbs which I have seen myself and

3391
02:38:08,099 --> 02:38:05,529
I don't know how to to explain what's

3392
02:38:11,729 --> 02:38:08,109
what's going on with that but I've seen

3393
02:38:13,860 --> 02:38:11,739
it over and over again lo I've seen it

3394
02:38:16,679 --> 02:38:13,870
close to the earth of course there's the

3395
02:38:19,590 --> 02:38:16,689
famous green chrome balls and then up

3396
02:38:20,849 --> 02:38:19,600
high in the atmosphere I don't know I

3397
02:38:22,590 --> 02:38:20,859
don't know what's going on with it

3398
02:38:26,340 --> 02:38:22,600
hi you're live on fade to black who's

3399
02:38:27,809 --> 02:38:26,350
calling hey Jimmy my name is Josh hey

3400
02:38:28,280 --> 02:38:27,819
Josh how are you where are you calling

3401
02:38:34,110 --> 02:38:28,290
from

3402
02:38:38,309 --> 02:38:34,120
good good great oh yeah what's on your

3403
02:38:40,950 --> 02:38:38,319
mind well a couple things first I wanted

3404
02:38:43,110 --> 02:38:40,960
to address their recent guests you had

3405
02:38:45,510 --> 02:38:43,120
on the program and some of the things

3406
02:38:49,620 --> 02:38:45,520
that were being discussed in the area of

3407
02:38:52,559 --> 02:38:49,630
demonology right this is something I've

3408
02:38:54,330 --> 02:38:52,569
recently delved into quite deeply after

3409
02:38:57,719 --> 02:38:54,340
studying from different directions

3410
02:39:03,630 --> 02:38:57,729
throughout my life I'm sorry

3411
02:39:06,900 --> 02:39:03,640
and I would tend to I think I could add

3412
02:39:10,110 --> 02:39:06,910
something to that and maybe straighten

3413
02:39:12,750 --> 02:39:10,120
some things out back in the ancient

3414
02:39:14,429 --> 02:39:12,760
times the people didn't I don't think

3415
02:39:15,719 --> 02:39:14,439
they really believed in demons

3416
02:39:18,510 --> 02:39:15,729
the way that most

3417
02:39:21,300 --> 02:39:18,520
we'll think of demons today they

3418
02:39:24,869 --> 02:39:21,310
considered the deeds diseases and the

3419
02:39:29,099 --> 02:39:24,879
infections of the soul and the mind they

3420
02:39:31,260 --> 02:39:29,109
considered these demons demons you know

3421
02:39:33,149 --> 02:39:31,270
very what's where we get the word from

3422
02:39:35,369 --> 02:39:33,159
but they weren't exactly the way we

3423
02:39:38,279 --> 02:39:35,379
imagined them and envision them today as

3424
02:39:41,189 --> 02:39:38,289
these dark forces they were the

3425
02:39:44,039 --> 02:39:41,199
sicknesses the various sicknesses and a

3426
02:39:46,399 --> 02:39:44,049
lot of times they felt that the disease

3427
02:39:49,709 --> 02:39:46,409
the mind and the way that we thought and

3428
02:39:52,590 --> 02:39:49,719
you know eating and pure thinking impure

3429
02:39:54,659 --> 02:39:52,600
and living impure were the things that

3430
02:39:57,899 --> 02:39:54,669
allowed the body to be inhabited by

3431
02:40:01,139 --> 02:39:57,909
these types of you know negative

3432
02:40:03,829 --> 02:40:01,149
thoughts or you know really the things

3433
02:40:07,019 --> 02:40:03,839
that we attributed to these things so

3434
02:40:10,889 --> 02:40:07,029
they felt that the different plants and

3435
02:40:14,340 --> 02:40:10,899
the different remedies that were

3436
02:40:17,340 --> 02:40:14,350
available in the plant kingdom were the

3437
02:40:20,880 --> 02:40:17,350
different remedies for battling these

3438
02:40:23,309 --> 02:40:20,890
and these were also daily these were

3439
02:40:27,569 --> 02:40:23,319
good demons and they fought the bad

3440
02:40:30,059 --> 02:40:27,579
demons and so when they're talking about

3441
02:40:32,999 --> 02:40:30,069
exorcism a lot of the times what they're

3442
02:40:35,670 --> 02:40:33,009
talking about is is exercising the

3443
02:40:37,529 --> 02:40:35,680
illnesses from the body and taking the

3444
02:40:39,269 --> 02:40:37,539
illnesses and removing the illnesses

3445
02:40:41,819 --> 02:40:39,279
from the body and that's what the shaman

3446
02:40:45,209 --> 02:40:41,829
or the magician or the priest the early

3447
02:40:48,869 --> 02:40:45,219
version of the priest was doing well it

3448
02:40:51,840 --> 02:40:48,879
could have been and well okay this is

3449
02:40:56,939 --> 02:40:51,850
this is what I think and I'm no expert

3450
02:40:58,079 --> 02:40:56,949
here but I would venture to guess you

3451
02:41:01,949 --> 02:40:58,089
know let's push back

3452
02:41:04,529 --> 02:41:01,959
let's go beyond 200 years okay before

3453
02:41:07,609 --> 02:41:04,539
modern medicine started to kick in and

3454
02:41:12,630 --> 02:41:07,619
certainly the last hundred years with

3455
02:41:15,449 --> 02:41:12,640
antibiotics okay but if you go back 200

3456
02:41:17,340 --> 02:41:15,459
300 400 500 thousand years ago where

3457
02:41:21,389 --> 02:41:17,350
there was an infection in the body or

3458
02:41:26,590 --> 02:41:21,399
plague or anything like that where

3459
02:41:28,599 --> 02:41:26,600
the only diagnosis was possession that

3460
02:41:32,439 --> 02:41:28,609
it was demonic when they didn't know

3461
02:41:36,029 --> 02:41:32,449
that it was an infected tooth right or

3462
02:41:39,029 --> 02:41:36,039
something else that had taken over

3463
02:41:42,639 --> 02:41:39,039
somebody's body that eventually led to

3464
02:41:45,340 --> 02:41:42,649
hallucinations and and and and brain

3465
02:41:48,609 --> 02:41:45,350
trauma you know that's that's that's

3466
02:41:51,279 --> 02:41:48,619
where I've always naturally kind of gone

3467
02:41:54,219 --> 02:41:51,289
with my own mind and that where it was

3468
02:41:57,909 --> 02:41:54,229
just the church would not allow any type

3469
02:42:01,449 --> 02:41:57,919
of medical diagnosis to come into play

3470
02:42:03,670 --> 02:42:01,459
that it was always demonic well it's

3471
02:42:04,960 --> 02:42:03,680
it's it's interesting because you know I

3472
02:42:07,300 --> 02:42:04,970
think that a lot of people would think

3473
02:42:10,329 --> 02:42:07,310
in similar ways to what you've just

3474
02:42:12,519 --> 02:42:10,339
you've just professed when you just when

3475
02:42:15,340 --> 02:42:12,529
you just said that I think it's a common

3476
02:42:17,260 --> 02:42:15,350
belief and an understanding among people

3477
02:42:20,979 --> 02:42:17,270
that mature you know that when you don't

3478
02:42:24,249 --> 02:42:20,989
really have a very good solid

3479
02:42:26,619 --> 02:42:24,259
understanding of ancient history we all

3480
02:42:30,029 --> 02:42:26,629
and I did this for many years we all

3481
02:42:32,649 --> 02:42:30,039
tend to fill the blanks and with our

3482
02:42:34,029 --> 02:42:32,659
imagination and the way we imagine it

3483
02:42:36,309 --> 02:42:34,039
must have been or the way that we

3484
02:42:39,309 --> 02:42:36,319
imagine it sure it was based on what we

3485
02:42:43,659 --> 02:42:39,319
know absolutely but I think the truth is

3486
02:42:46,510 --> 02:42:43,669
that's actually before the church and

3487
02:42:49,119 --> 02:42:46,520
eaten up until the church time we had

3488
02:42:53,739 --> 02:42:49,129
the ancient people had an extremely

3489
02:42:58,090 --> 02:42:53,749
advanced awareness of medicine and the

3490
02:43:01,569 --> 02:42:58,100
mind and they did that through the use

3491
02:43:04,149 --> 02:43:01,579
of psychedelics mostly the mushroom and

3492
02:43:08,229 --> 02:43:04,159
this was something that they explored

3493
02:43:11,559 --> 02:43:08,239
very very intensely and itself was

3494
02:43:13,719 --> 02:43:11,569
considered a very healing thing so it

3495
02:43:16,179 --> 02:43:13,729
was not just healing for the body to

3496
02:43:18,159 --> 02:43:16,189
cure diseases and things like that but

3497
02:43:20,079 --> 02:43:18,169
it was also it was extremely healing for

3498
02:43:22,359 --> 02:43:20,089
the mind than the soul which was really

3499
02:43:24,369 --> 02:43:22,369
what they felt got to the root of a lot

3500
02:43:26,859 --> 02:43:24,379
of the illnesses so when the Catholic

3501
02:43:29,619 --> 02:43:26,869
Church came around what they did was

3502
02:43:32,829 --> 02:43:29,629
they basically eliminated and demonized

3503
02:43:34,120 --> 02:43:32,839
the mushroom and by demonizing the

3504
02:43:35,980 --> 02:43:34,130
mushroom which was

3505
02:43:38,320 --> 02:43:35,990
which was one of the things that they

3506
02:43:39,850 --> 02:43:38,330
would give people to cure things they

3507
02:43:41,740 --> 02:43:39,860
could you know a lot of things could

3508
02:43:43,450 --> 02:43:41,750
result a lot of ideas could result from

3509
02:43:46,179 --> 02:43:43,460
that and the church when they took over

3510
02:43:47,860 --> 02:43:46,189
got rid of a lot of these caring and

3511
02:43:49,540 --> 02:43:47,870
healing things and tried to say that the

3512
02:43:51,670 --> 02:43:49,550
all of this had to come through the

3513
02:43:53,980 --> 02:43:51,680
church and through this the the priests

3514
02:43:56,260 --> 02:43:53,990
in the church but which was really just

3515
02:43:59,080 --> 02:43:56,270
a continuation of a shaman priest from

3516
02:44:01,210 --> 02:43:59,090
from before and role in Rome these

3517
02:44:03,610 --> 02:44:01,220
priests and the controllers of the

3518
02:44:05,530 --> 02:44:03,620
Catholic Church were no dummies at the

3519
02:44:07,360 --> 02:44:05,540
time they were extremely knowledgeable

3520
02:44:11,440 --> 02:44:07,370
but what they wanted to do is propel

3521
02:44:13,810 --> 02:44:11,450
humanity into the darkness and keep us

3522
02:44:17,320 --> 02:44:13,820
away from the knowledge of the healing

3523
02:44:21,160 --> 02:44:17,330
abilities of the plants because they had

3524
02:44:24,310 --> 02:44:21,170
to control that's that's really the

3525
02:44:26,350 --> 02:44:24,320
bottom line here and Josh I really

3526
02:44:28,719 --> 02:44:26,360
appreciate the phone call men very very

3527
02:44:30,610 --> 02:44:28,729
insightful thank you so much thank you

3528
02:44:33,730 --> 02:44:30,620
for having me man have a great night

3529
02:44:37,270 --> 02:44:33,740
at that and see the the other part of

3530
02:44:39,719 --> 02:44:37,280
that is when you think about the the

3531
02:44:43,300 --> 02:44:39,729
Catholic Church back then or any

3532
02:44:46,960 --> 02:44:43,310
religious organization that was dominant

3533
02:44:51,610 --> 02:44:46,970
in in that particular culture is that

3534
02:44:54,040 --> 02:44:51,620
you especially as a doctor or somebody

3535
02:44:55,990 --> 02:44:54,050
that called to call themselves a doctor

3536
02:44:59,560 --> 02:44:56,000
was trying to figure that stuff out you

3537
02:45:03,190 --> 02:44:59,570
aren't gonna overrule the church not in

3538
02:45:04,690 --> 02:45:03,200
your town it just wasn't gonna happen if

3539
02:45:07,990 --> 02:45:04,700
you wanted to say you know what I think

3540
02:45:09,610 --> 02:45:08,000
I think there's a thing there's a fever

3541
02:45:11,260 --> 02:45:09,620
here I think there's something else

3542
02:45:12,940 --> 02:45:11,270
going I think there's you know I think

3543
02:45:14,020 --> 02:45:12,950
there's something happening here I don't

3544
02:45:16,330 --> 02:45:14,030
think it's demonic

3545
02:45:18,010 --> 02:45:16,340
you're not gonna overrule the church

3546
02:45:21,040 --> 02:45:18,020
you're not going to be able to go in and

3547
02:45:24,160 --> 02:45:21,050
try some cure that ain't gonna happen

3548
02:45:26,200 --> 02:45:24,170
and then there's just no way there's no

3549
02:45:35,820 --> 02:45:26,210
way that that was gonna happen hi you're

3550
02:45:41,679 --> 02:45:39,100
I'm calling from the Caribbean I'm

3551
02:45:43,510 --> 02:45:41,689
French you're French calling from the

3552
02:45:47,500 --> 02:45:43,520
Caribbean how are you what's your name

3553
02:45:50,650 --> 02:45:47,510
yes my name is Luna

3554
02:45:55,000 --> 02:45:50,660
Leonel calling from Guadeloupe right on

3555
02:45:58,240 --> 02:45:55,010
man how are you at the loop doing fine

3556
02:46:02,290 --> 02:45:58,250
it's my first time calling and I'm not

3557
02:46:04,150 --> 02:46:02,300
even it's hard for me to speak English

3558
02:46:06,820 --> 02:46:04,160
but I really wanted to call you

3559
02:46:12,190 --> 02:46:06,830
who thank you for your show the quality

3560
02:46:14,920 --> 02:46:12,200
of your work say hi to everybody thank

3561
02:46:18,340 --> 02:46:14,930
you so much for that man and I really

3562
02:46:20,530 --> 02:46:18,350
appreciate the phone call and and since

3563
02:46:21,730 --> 02:46:20,540
you've taken the time to call in when

3564
02:46:24,540 --> 02:46:21,740
you what did you think of the show

3565
02:46:39,700 --> 02:46:31,990
I really carefully in it was a really

3566
02:46:42,910 --> 02:46:39,710
interesting subject and it's I'm sorry

3567
02:46:46,540 --> 02:46:42,920
I'm losing words but I really like this

3568
02:46:50,320 --> 02:46:46,550
subject in dark and it's like watching a

3569
02:46:52,269 --> 02:46:50,330
neuro movie yes I know right I'd I'd

3570
02:46:54,070 --> 02:46:52,279
totally agree there were a couple of

3571
02:47:06,300 --> 02:46:54,080
times tonight Lionel where I was just

3572
02:47:10,300 --> 02:47:08,050
buddies whoa

3573
02:47:13,620 --> 02:47:10,310
I know huge I know you should get the

3574
02:47:17,050 --> 02:47:13,630
book and and and read the full story

3575
02:47:19,000 --> 02:47:17,060
it's a it's absolutely amazing well

3576
02:47:21,639 --> 02:47:19,010
listen Lionel thank you I know you're a

3577
02:47:27,070 --> 02:47:21,649
first-time caller but call back anytime

3578
02:47:30,630 --> 02:47:27,080
okay okay just thank you for your show

3579
02:47:34,900 --> 02:47:30,640
you you seem to be a really good guy and

3580
02:47:37,510 --> 02:47:34,910
I watch your show almost every night

3581
02:47:41,730 --> 02:47:37,520
thank you so much and and spread the

3582
02:47:45,160 --> 02:47:41,740
word in the Caribbean will you okay

3583
02:47:47,620 --> 02:47:45,170
Thank You Lionel have a great night

3584
02:47:51,820 --> 02:47:47,630
thank you thank you thank you you too

3585
02:47:52,410 --> 02:47:51,830
bye the Caribbean calling in to fade to

3586
02:47:57,099 --> 02:47:52,420
black

3587
02:47:59,559 --> 02:47:57,109
yeah gotta love that right there

3588
02:48:03,639 --> 02:47:59,569
let's stay on the phones he's right

3589
02:48:05,859 --> 02:48:03,649
though the 500 bodies in her time I'm

3590
02:48:08,800 --> 02:48:05,869
telling you you guys gotta get this book

3591
02:48:11,909 --> 02:48:08,810
and there are literally hundreds and

3592
02:48:14,469 --> 02:48:11,919
hundreds of references of different

3593
02:48:16,959 --> 02:48:14,479
archeological digs around the world

3594
02:48:18,550 --> 02:48:16,969
about the subject it's absolutely

3595
02:48:21,909 --> 02:48:18,560
incredible hi you're live on fade to

3596
02:48:25,989 --> 02:48:21,919
black who's calling hey Jimmy this is

3597
02:48:27,609 --> 02:48:25,999
Joey hey Joey how are you ma'am doing

3598
02:48:29,499 --> 02:48:27,619
all right I got a crick in my neck I

3599
02:48:30,939 --> 02:48:29,509
feel like this you ever get this burning

3600
02:48:32,739 --> 02:48:30,949
sensation across your chest like

3601
02:48:35,709 --> 02:48:32,749
somebody's got a voodoo doll yeah I get

3602
02:48:41,829 --> 02:48:35,719
it yeah I get it every day what about

3603
02:48:44,859 --> 02:48:41,839
right now yeah right now somebody out

3604
02:48:52,889 --> 02:48:44,869
there is poking pins into a voodoo doll

3605
02:48:59,319 --> 02:48:57,429
listen I want to tell you I noticed

3606
02:49:01,329 --> 02:48:59,329
earlier today in the news that you know

3607
02:49:03,309 --> 02:49:01,339
they changed Columbus Day to indigenous

3608
02:49:07,239 --> 02:49:03,319
peoples day and whatever you know they

3609
02:49:08,949 --> 02:49:07,249
benefit well they did it in like Arizona

3610
02:49:11,619 --> 02:49:08,959
something like that with some some state

3611
02:49:14,019 --> 02:49:11,629
or some mayor just redid it or whatever

3612
02:49:17,879 --> 02:49:14,029
but uh so I said well who was here

3613
02:49:21,069 --> 02:49:17,889
before the Native Americans you know and

3614
02:49:22,539 --> 02:49:21,079
you know but just started talking about

3615
02:49:25,539 --> 02:49:22,549
this with this lady about you know

3616
02:49:26,829 --> 02:49:25,549
dismissive history and stuff and one of

3617
02:49:28,839 --> 02:49:26,839
your listeners or somebody in the

3618
02:49:32,379 --> 02:49:28,849
Twitter feed you guys check it out she

3619
02:49:35,169 --> 02:49:32,389
put up an article about these a giant

3620
02:49:38,079 --> 02:49:35,179
study one area that I found in Missouri

3621
02:49:39,999 --> 02:49:38,089
I think it'll hundreds of feet deep on

3622
02:49:42,039 --> 02:49:40,009
the ground or something I didn't read

3623
02:49:43,989 --> 02:49:42,049
the whole thing but it was intriguing

3624
02:49:48,309 --> 02:49:43,999
and it's odd that it just all kind of

3625
02:49:50,739 --> 02:49:48,319
you know lined up like that but anyhow

3626
02:49:52,059 --> 02:49:50,749
you know where's the mission history of

3627
02:49:55,089 --> 02:49:52,069
America who was here before the

3628
02:49:57,059 --> 02:49:55,099
indigenous people you know the where's

3629
02:49:59,229 --> 02:49:57,069
the proof where's where's that I mean

3630
02:50:03,609 --> 02:49:59,239
life didn't start in America or North

3631
02:50:07,929 --> 02:50:03,619
America did it well see look there Joey

3632
02:50:09,590 --> 02:50:07,939
when this subject comes up it is one of

3633
02:50:15,439 --> 02:50:09,600
the most heated are

3634
02:50:18,429 --> 02:50:15,449
and and the the if we if we listen to

3635
02:50:21,199 --> 02:50:18,439
what historians are trying to tell us

3636
02:50:23,899 --> 02:50:21,209
anthropologists and who have chased back

3637
02:50:27,469 --> 02:50:23,909
DNA and traced it that you know

3638
02:50:30,710 --> 02:50:27,479
everything the Inuits and and going up

3639
02:50:32,300 --> 02:50:30,720
through Alaska and the Bering Strait and

3640
02:50:37,689 --> 02:50:32,310
the land bridge that went over to

3641
02:50:42,550 --> 02:50:37,699
Siberia that apparently were Russians

3642
02:50:48,170 --> 02:50:42,560
right apparently that that is the case

3643
02:50:51,079 --> 02:50:48,180
and now if we go back further now so

3644
02:50:52,250 --> 02:50:51,089
that supposedly happened around 15,000

3645
02:50:55,010 --> 02:50:52,260
years ago okay

3646
02:50:57,409 --> 02:50:55,020
all right all right all right okay I can

3647
02:51:00,769 --> 02:50:57,419
I can buy into some of that but then we

3648
02:51:04,609 --> 02:51:00,779
just had the recent discoveries in San

3649
02:51:06,920 --> 02:51:04,619
Diego and you can go and check this out

3650
02:51:12,199 --> 02:51:06,930
the press releases came out about a year

3651
02:51:14,869 --> 02:51:12,209
ago of homo sapien sapien a hundred and

3652
02:51:19,819 --> 02:51:14,879
fifty thousand years ago killing

3653
02:51:23,269 --> 02:51:19,829
mammoths in san diego and apparently the

3654
02:51:29,750 --> 02:51:23,279
the bones of the mammoths had strike

3655
02:51:34,359 --> 02:51:29,760
marks from Flint knives okay so there

3656
02:51:38,809 --> 02:51:34,369
you go so now that tips over completely

3657
02:51:43,309 --> 02:51:38,819
the original and accepted largely

3658
02:51:46,579 --> 02:51:43,319
accepted way that the original Americans

3659
02:51:48,619 --> 02:51:46,589
got here were from the Bering Strait

3660
02:51:50,479 --> 02:51:48,629
land bridge but apparently it predated

3661
02:51:52,550 --> 02:51:50,489
that by another hundred hundred fifty

3662
02:51:57,469 --> 02:51:52,560
thousand years so I don't know you know

3663
02:51:59,960 --> 02:51:57,479
and I I have I have no clue the other

3664
02:52:01,909 --> 02:51:59,970
part to all of this when we talk about

3665
02:52:04,540 --> 02:52:01,919
you know where man came from and

3666
02:52:09,590 --> 02:52:04,550
everything points to Central and South

3667
02:52:12,739 --> 02:52:09,600
Africa and and Lucy and and going back

3668
02:52:18,979 --> 02:52:12,749
in an australopith ekeus and and Homo

3669
02:52:22,219 --> 02:52:18,989
erectus the the that would indicate a

3670
02:52:23,131 --> 02:52:22,229
migration from southern and Central

3671
02:52:27,121 --> 02:52:23,141
Africa going

3672
02:52:31,291 --> 02:52:27,131
north but the other parts to all of this

3673
02:52:35,491 --> 02:52:31,301
now is indicating northern Siberia and

3674
02:52:38,430 --> 02:52:35,501
heading south into Mesopotamia because

3675
02:52:41,640 --> 02:52:38,440
that is where if you look at gobekli

3676
02:52:45,301 --> 02:52:41,650
tepe today Gobekli Tepe is 12,000 years

3677
02:52:48,991 --> 02:52:45,311
old now gobekli tepe apparently was

3678
02:52:52,411 --> 02:52:49,001
built from migration that came from the

3679
02:52:58,831 --> 02:52:52,421
north down to the south you would think

3680
02:53:02,491 --> 02:52:58,841
that it was from Egypt and ancient Sumer

3681
02:53:05,551 --> 02:53:02,501
Mesopotamia going north but there's a

3682
02:53:07,501 --> 02:53:05,561
7000 year gap between gobekli tepe

3683
02:53:11,341 --> 02:53:07,511
and what was going on in ancient Sumer

3684
02:53:14,970 --> 02:53:11,351
and in ancient Egypt so it contradicts

3685
02:53:15,390 --> 02:53:14,980
themselves right so now where did we go

3686
02:53:19,881 --> 02:53:15,400
with that

3687
02:53:23,661 --> 02:53:19,891
we you know I I don't know and how would

3688
02:53:26,220 --> 02:53:23,671
central and southern African

3689
02:53:29,220 --> 02:53:26,230
civilizations migrate all the way up to

3690
02:53:31,621 --> 02:53:29,230
Siberia and then come around to the

3691
02:53:34,261 --> 02:53:31,631
south again again any I guess anything

3692
02:53:37,171 --> 02:53:34,271
is possible but the way that they are

3693
02:53:39,001 --> 02:53:37,181
chasing this DNA back we've got two

3694
02:53:41,371 --> 02:53:39,011
separate things that are happening here

3695
02:53:45,381 --> 02:53:41,381
one in southern Africa and Central

3696
02:53:48,961 --> 02:53:45,391
Africa and one up in northern Siberia

3697
02:53:50,220 --> 02:53:48,971
Wow I mean unless I find that like

3698
02:53:52,111 --> 02:53:50,230
you're saying earlier like that

3699
02:53:54,060 --> 02:53:52,121
earth-shattering evidence of something

3700
02:53:56,161 --> 02:53:54,070
you know together tell us the whole

3701
02:53:58,011 --> 02:53:56,171
story the whole history or just even

3702
02:54:00,211 --> 02:53:58,021
just one sliver of it you know could

3703
02:54:03,421 --> 02:54:00,221
like you said it's a narrow you know

3704
02:54:04,921 --> 02:54:03,431
points in the right direction that's

3705
02:54:10,791 --> 02:54:04,931
what they you know see that's what I

3706
02:54:14,131 --> 02:54:10,801
want to have happen I would have thought

3707
02:54:17,211 --> 02:54:14,141
Joey and I'm being very serious when I

3708
02:54:20,100 --> 02:54:17,221
say this I would have thought that

3709
02:54:24,001 --> 02:54:20,110
gobekli tepe which clearly was not

3710
02:54:26,761 --> 02:54:24,011
supposed to exist okay it was not

3711
02:54:29,491 --> 02:54:26,771
supposed to exist and it's there and

3712
02:54:33,661 --> 02:54:29,501
it's 12,000 years old that that would

3713
02:54:35,791 --> 02:54:33,671
cause all history to be rewritten they

3714
02:54:36,690 --> 02:54:35,801
didn't do it in fact they don't even

3715
02:54:40,170 --> 02:54:36,700
talk about

3716
02:54:44,610 --> 02:54:40,180
don't you think that Gobekli Tepe what

3717
02:54:48,150 --> 02:54:44,620
should have been in 1995 the headline

3718
02:54:51,770 --> 02:54:48,160
news on every single broadcast on this

3719
02:54:55,200 --> 02:54:51,780
planet including or yeah I can write

3720
02:54:56,450 --> 02:54:55,210
yeah yeah you didn't hear about it until

3721
02:55:00,810 --> 02:54:56,460
fade to black

3722
02:55:03,600 --> 02:55:00,820
until this show you know there were and

3723
02:55:06,660 --> 02:55:03,610
and not to say that we broke the news we

3724
02:55:08,190 --> 02:55:06,670
didn't you know there were plenty of you

3725
02:55:10,230 --> 02:55:08,200
know Linda Moulton Howe was out there

3726
02:55:12,890 --> 02:55:10,240
and John Anthony West was out there and

3727
02:55:15,330 --> 02:55:12,900
and Graham Hancock and Robert Schoch

3728
02:55:18,630 --> 02:55:15,340
they were all out there checking it out

3729
02:55:22,050 --> 02:55:18,640
but nobody would listen to all of us you

3730
02:55:25,560 --> 02:55:22,060
know fringe researchers you know fringe

3731
02:55:28,980 --> 02:55:25,570
radio shows and and ancient aliens no we

3732
02:55:32,100 --> 02:55:28,990
don't count but that that is how big of

3733
02:55:35,460 --> 02:55:32,110
a story gobekli tepe is now this is back

3734
02:55:40,820 --> 02:55:35,470
to my point if we find another gobekli

3735
02:55:44,490 --> 02:55:40,830
tepe right it's some kind of proof of of

3736
02:55:47,460 --> 02:55:44,500
Atlantis of Lemuria and and in some

3737
02:55:50,000 --> 02:55:47,470
breaking situation where now it's not

3738
02:55:52,100 --> 02:55:50,010
even 12,000 years old but maybe it's

3739
02:56:05,640 --> 02:55:52,110
50,000 years old

3740
02:56:07,740 --> 02:56:05,650
mm-hm are we gonna hear about it no no

3741
02:56:09,360 --> 02:56:07,750
Luke Rowe France well they found him in

3742
02:56:10,920 --> 02:56:09,370
Spain they found him in France they

3743
02:56:14,870 --> 02:56:10,930
found him in Italy and they found him in

3744
02:56:19,920 --> 02:56:14,880
Australia all of them dating between

3745
02:56:23,730 --> 02:56:19,930
20,000 and 45,000 years ago and and some

3746
02:56:27,600 --> 02:56:23,740
of them are the most elaborate 3d fine

3747
02:56:29,429 --> 02:56:27,610
art you know local you and I when we

3748
02:56:32,340 --> 02:56:29,439
were five years old drawing stick

3749
02:56:34,260 --> 02:56:32,350
figures right of our family or not right

3750
02:56:37,580 --> 02:56:34,270
okay that's not what's on these these

3751
02:56:41,490 --> 02:56:37,590
these walls we are talking about a

3752
02:56:44,980 --> 02:56:41,500
beautiful beautiful artwork so I'm

3753
02:56:47,740 --> 02:56:44,990
seeing the what hurts are what the same

3754
02:56:50,200 --> 02:56:47,750
oh yeah that's a lot that's in Lacroix

3755
02:56:52,841 --> 02:56:50,210
France and that documentary that

3756
02:56:56,070 --> 02:56:52,851
documentary I loved Werner Herzog he's

3757
02:56:58,690 --> 02:56:56,080
the best that documentaries that

3758
02:57:00,850 --> 02:56:58,700
documentaries one of the best

3759
02:57:04,570 --> 02:57:00,860
documentaries about ancient

3760
02:57:07,770 --> 02:57:04,580
civilizations period that's ever been

3761
02:57:11,080 --> 02:57:07,780
done and it took him we'll make it but

3762
02:57:12,761 --> 02:57:11,090
that we weren't supposed to have that

3763
02:57:15,341 --> 02:57:12,771
kind of sophistication we weren't

3764
02:57:17,110 --> 02:57:15,351
supposed to think about art we weren't

3765
02:57:20,230 --> 02:57:17,120
you know we weren't supposed to be able

3766
02:57:23,591 --> 02:57:20,240
to do that but obviously we did right so

3767
02:57:26,171 --> 02:57:23,601
yeah it was that the game-changer that

3768
02:57:28,780 --> 02:57:26,181
rewrote history nobody wants to look

3769
02:57:31,870 --> 02:57:28,790
like a chance and and write history like

3770
02:57:34,780 --> 02:57:31,880
that and I don't don't I don't get it I

3771
02:57:37,301 --> 02:57:34,790
don't Joey gobekli tepe

3772
02:57:39,610 --> 02:57:37,311
is just like those cave paintings

3773
02:57:42,761 --> 02:57:39,620
gobekli tepe is probably the most

3774
02:57:45,461 --> 02:57:42,771
important historical site on planet

3775
02:57:48,190 --> 02:57:45,471
Earth more important than Giza more

3776
02:57:50,381 --> 02:57:48,200
important than the the Great Sphinx and

3777
02:57:53,200 --> 02:57:50,391
I'm not discounting any of that but

3778
02:57:56,560 --> 02:57:53,210
we've clearly we've clearly dated it

3779
02:57:59,860 --> 02:57:56,570
carbon dated it to eleven thousand and

3780
02:58:02,290 --> 02:57:59,870
older if there's a possibility that some

3781
02:58:03,881 --> 02:58:02,300
of the site is even another five four or

3782
02:58:06,730 --> 02:58:03,891
five thousand years older than what

3783
02:58:08,500 --> 02:58:06,740
we've already got now well we've only

3784
02:58:11,381 --> 02:58:08,510
discovered like a tenth of it right

3785
02:58:13,860 --> 02:58:11,391
that's right and 20% it's huge

3786
02:58:17,110 --> 02:58:13,870
yes it's like it's huge it's

3787
02:58:17,560 --> 02:58:17,120
unbelievable we just found the newest

3788
02:58:20,171 --> 02:58:17,570
stuff

3789
02:58:21,881 --> 02:58:20,181
well Joey I got it I got a rock on out

3790
02:58:25,690 --> 02:58:21,891
of here man see you tomorrow night thank

3791
02:58:27,671 --> 02:58:25,700
you to the phone call crate phone call

3792
02:58:30,370 --> 02:58:27,681
right there great great night on this

3793
02:58:31,900 --> 02:58:30,380
show unbelievable I want to thank

3794
02:58:34,600 --> 02:58:31,910
everybody that called tonight and

3795
02:58:37,921 --> 02:58:34,610
everybody that tweeted and of course dr.

3796
02:58:39,751 --> 02:58:37,931
heather Lynn the book is evil archeology

3797
02:58:42,411 --> 02:58:39,761
dr. Heather

3798
02:58:45,301 --> 02:58:42,421
dot-com and you can also find it on

3799
02:58:47,850 --> 02:58:45,311
Amazon beta black's executive producers

3800
02:58:49,921 --> 02:58:47,860
ridic amore on shows produced by Hilton

3801
02:58:51,810 --> 02:58:49,931
Jay Paul Renee Dennis and Bob announces

3802
02:58:52,401 --> 02:58:51,820
our Steve harver gene photo a Marty

3803
02:58:55,171 --> 02:58:52,411
colbaugh

3804
02:58:58,861 --> 02:58:55,181
webmaster is Drew the geek music doug

3805
02:59:02,131 --> 02:58:58,871
aldrich intro space boy space boy

3806
02:59:04,111 --> 02:59:02,141
music.com fade to black is produced by

3807
02:59:08,251 --> 02:59:04,121
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3808
02:59:10,501 --> 02:59:08,261
syndication is kgr a the planet spark a

3809
02:59:12,241 --> 02:59:10,511
stone a copyright a 2019 by fade to

3810
02:59:15,541 --> 02:59:12,251
black in the game changer network

3811
02:59:17,191 --> 02:59:15,551
it cannot be rebroadcast downloaded copy

3812
02:59:19,591 --> 02:59:17,201
they're used anywhere in the known

3813
02:59:21,301 --> 02:59:19,601
universe without written permission from

3814
02:59:23,371 --> 02:59:21,311
fade to black of the game change the

3815
02:59:26,041 --> 02:59:23,381
network i'm your timmy church tomorrow

3816
02:59:29,911 --> 02:59:26,051
night is fate or night opened lines all

3817
02:59:32,671 --> 02:59:29,921
night long follow me on twitter @ JT

3818
02:59:36,191 --> 02:59:32,681
radio I'll see everybody tomorrow but

3819
02:59:40,220 --> 02:59:36,201
until then be safe